Do "Online-isms" Add to RP?


Do "Online-isms" Add to RP?

Poll ended at Fri Dec 20, 2013 11:35 am

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Re: Do "Online-isms" Add to RP?

Postby Glaucon » Wed Nov 20, 2013 12:03 pm

It depends. Should you want to play a role or play in a place that aren't covered in the books in much detail, I don't think it is a bad thing to make up some 'lore'.

So, say... if you and others were playing a mamba tribe, you might find it useful and fun to make up some shit that is supposedly related to mamba's. Language, customs, rites, a hierarchy, teeth-file techniques and how to make the best tooth-pick from human bone. Or something like that. That COULD add to the RP. And you might even teach it to newcomers.

(And you could be said to be following the books still. Filling in the blanks isn't changing/evolving the books, as long as they way you do it follows the spirit of the books. But you could call the stuff you created onlinisms, if they catch on).

Of course, that isn't the case in the example Kaitlin brought up. And I guess it isn't the case with onlinisms in general. People teach what they have been taught and take that as their gospel.
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Re: Do "Online-isms" Add to RP?

Postby Mat » Wed Nov 20, 2013 2:28 pm

I think that onlineisms are a good thing as it adds to the diversity of the rp environment. I think it is reasonable for someone to teach something that they were instructed. It adds to alterations from place to place in how they do things. I would much rather have a place that was going with the flow even if not straight from the book than to be in some place where everything was over analyzed for a simple game.
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Re: Do "Online-isms" Add to RP?

Postby Mynerva » Wed Nov 20, 2013 4:40 pm

No, they do not.

I do not care if people want to play out some crazy tea ceremony, I do not care if some people enjoy asking questions and getting the same boring ass answer all the time - I simply do not care.

What I always hated - and hated with a passion - was when those things were expected as the norm and every role player had to conform to those things and perform some crazy ass boring tea ceremony - exactly the same way someone invented it in some boring class! That is so mind numbingly boring!

As I said before - if people enjoy that kind of stuff and they want to play that they trained their own slaves like that - they can be my guest. But rolling into some place - waving a slave to one's side - and then expect the poor role player to play out that shit - even though it has nothing to do with what slaves would do or know in the books - is idiotic and it is incredibly boring!

I went to exactly one IC/OOC slave class in all my time in sl - and that did not end well :teehee:
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Re: Do "Online-isms" Add to RP?

Postby Cassie » Wed Nov 20, 2013 4:59 pm

I would be more up for RP classes and debates rather the personal opinion of what a person think is best for everyone.
If they wish to diversify it's ok but should be done by letting know it's on purpose and why it was decided so.

I personally participated to a couple when I started and learned nothing, the good training is a single person telling you to read the books and giving you a couple of post examples. The end.
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Re: Do "Online-isms" Add to RP?

Postby Darius of Turia » Wed Nov 20, 2013 7:12 pm

Sometimes an onlineism is usually formed by a person mistaking information that they got from the books. Slave paces are not week explained until you get to the later books, who ever made this class probibly had not read them all our past hunters. We all talk about how hard the books are too read, so can you blame them?

As for if it adds to rp, no it damages rp by spreading misinformation. Who ever does that class will share in that misinformation and go on roleplaying her role incorrectly and make them selves look silly. Though personally I attempt to fix these issues by contacting the class leader and showing them proper information such as what I can find on the gorean cave.
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Re: Do "Online-isms" Add to RP?

Postby Acosmist » Wed Nov 20, 2013 11:09 pm

In this particular example, I believe that it actually takes away from RP. Going through the paces during slave training can be a great set of scenes. And when you then approach a slave in character and refer to 'slave paces' anyone trained in his fashion would then assume you're talking about "the purpose of a collar is.." Well sure, a Master might ask his slave a set of rote questions to reinforce ideas, but they aren't 'paces' as we know them from the novels.
When I think of paces, I think of the auction block. I've never seen an auctioneer put a slave to her paces on the auction block. Never. "Nadu. Look angry! Pout! Look scared, arch your back, stand, thrust your hip out, look insolent!"
Nope, never.

So, speaking of Haifa.. a friend of mine decided I should go with her to one of these advertised classes. I felt ill just contemplating it, but she insisted, so along I went.
It was as bad as I had thought, not really the content as much as the method of delivery.
Before my arrival, my friend was told to not sit on the chairs. Those were for "free"... oh boy, did I have to stay anylonger to figure out it was going to be shit? No, but I did anyway.

Prime Bbcode Spoiler Show Prime Bbcode Spoiler:
[08:04] Elicia (faolynne): Greetings and welcome. I am called Elicia by my Owner.

[08:04] Elicia (faolynne): The class today will teach you about some of the basics of role play and online safety. This is a level 1 required class, which will benefit not only slaves but also the Free. You will learn some guidelines that will help you as you encounter certain situations in Haifa. It also will give you the chance to think about limits that you may want to place and help you decide just how much information you want to provide others about yourself.

[08:05] Elicia (faolynne): To begin, there are a few guidelines which will make sure that the class with run smoothly. During the class I will pause to ask for comments and/or questions. Please use the @ symbols to let me know you would like to be called upon. I will call upon you in the order they are received.

[08:05] Elicia (faolynne): Asking questions will never be seen as a bother, so please don't hesitate to ask if something needs clarification. Not only does it have the benefit of setting your mind at ease, it can in fact help others in the class with a new understanding on how to do things!

[08:05] Elicia (faolynne): Once class has formally begun, I ask that you do not emote greetings so that the class can run without interruption. This doesn't mean you can let all your manners fall by the wayside, but we are not actively engaged in role play at this time. Also, if you need to leave or go AFK during the class, please do so silently, this will again prevent interruptions.

[08:06] Elicia (faolynne): If you find this class to be useful to you, and wish to support Port Haifa, there is a bottle for tips to my left. Tips are not required, but are appreciated greatly!

[08:06] Elicia (faolynne): For House of Khon slaves, you must attend the entire class for you card to be signed. I do understand that real life can intrude, but attendance of the full class is required to receive credit for it.

[08:07] Elicia (faolynne): All right, let's begin with some of the very basics:

[08:07] Elicia (faolynne): ~~What is Role Play?~~

[08:07] Elicia (faolynne): Let's start with the very basics. What exactly is role play? Role play is engaging in a behaviour or set of behaviours that are in sync with the type of character, or role which you chose to play in Second Life. This character should have a back story. For example were your born a slave on Gor? Were you once a Free Woman who by mishap fell into the collar? Were you a barbarian (from Earth) who was captured and brought to Gor?

[08:08] Elicia (faolynne): This character or role may be very much like the player on the opposite side of the screen, or the absolute opposite. If you are quite similar to your chosen character, you will sometimes hear it referred to as being more "immersed" in your role play. If your role is quite unlike your character it will usually be something that is "played" rather that it being a direct line between your thoughts and action.

[08:08] Elicia (faolynne): In Haifa we have role players from both ends of the spectrum, as well as those who fit somewhere in between. There is no right or wrong to this, we all just choose to interact differently.

[08:09] Elicia (faolynne): ~~What does IC mean?~~

[08:09] Elicia (faolynne): You will often hear people referring to actions that are either IC or OOC, let me take a moment to touch on both. IC or "In Character". This means that you are responding to the situations and people around you based on your characters reaction, not necessarily your own. Anything posted in Local Chat should be done IC. There are exceptions to that, which I will touch on in a moment.
[08:09] Elicia (faolynne): ~~What does OOC mean?~~

[08:09] Kara (aahana): @

[08:10] Elicia (faolynne): Yes, Kara?

[08:10] Kara (aahana): OOC means Out Of Character, you are OOC when you are not rping, and OOC, you are not your character, you are just a normal RL person

[08:11] Elicia (faolynne): Yes, excellent. Thank you, Kara!

[08:11] Elicia (faolynne): OOC or Out of Character are action or words spoken while you are not actively in character. This applies when you are on a non Gorean sim, out shopping etc. Your private messages or IMs are also out of character. Therefore any information provided in them can not be used in role play. The choice is up to you on how you respond to other players in IMs. You might choose to still address a Free Person as Master or Mistress, or you may not. Neither is right or wrong, it is based on your level of immersion with your character and what feels most natural to you.

[08:11] Kara (aahana): @

[08:11] Elicia (faolynne): Yes, Kara?

[08:12] Ineytia: @

[08:12] Kara (aahana): Are you saying that when you consider that when OOC, there is no more Gorean people (who exist after all only in a fictional series of books), when you stop to play your role, when you consider that OOC, everyone is equal, no more slave, no more master/mistress, you are less capable of immersion in your RP?

[08:16] Elicia (faolynne): No, Kara. That is not what I was trying to say. I am saying that there may be a difference in how you address people in IM (which is considered OOC), and you IC (local chat) interactions. I don't suggest that someone who addresses a free as Master or Mistress is more immersed in their role play only excerscising different option. DId that make it more clear?

[08:17] Kara (aahana): Actually, yes. I would like only that this statement gets more accepted by many people, it would lead to less OOC discriminations in sims. But it,s probably a point on which we can come back later :) Excuse me for this interruption

[08:17] Elicia (faolynne) smiles "It is an excellent point, and one that I do go into more deeply a bit later in the class. Thank you for bringing it up"

[08:18] Elicia (faolynne): And Ineytia, you had a question?

[08:18] Kara (aahana): You're welcome :)

[08:18] Ineytia: I had typed it on NC, but you might have answered it : Yeah, I was going to remark on the same comment. It is almost insulting to be told that you need to resemble your character to be "more immersed" in your role. Infact, I would hazard to say that someone who is blurring that line between OOC and IC, where they do not so well distinguish between their selves in the real world and a fictional character in a fantasy planet are not immersed or roleplaying at all. Now, we can roleplay at all sorts of times in our lives, we roleplay even when we are in our RLs and perhaps doing hands on practical learning where we pretend to be engaged in different scenarios. But in this sense, I can't see how being "more" like your character is more immersive. I play every character in Gor, free, slave, man, woman, and I must admit, what is more immersion breaking are those that believe themselves to be their characters in any degree.....

[08:19] Kara (aahana): I totally agree with Ineytia's statement

[08:19] Elicia (faolynne): "Excellent input, thank you Ineyta!" smiles to her, "Let's see if I cover more of those concerns as we move on!"

[08:20] Elicia (faolynne): Slaves in Port Haifa are not required to obey any commands given to them in IMs. The Slave Manual you received upon enrolling in the academy is full of amazing information, including topics just like those I am covering today. It also gives you more indepth information and clarification on the topic of IMs!

[08:20] Elicia (faolynne): Please remember that not everyone plays the same way that you do, so the grumpy Master, the haughty Free Woman, the catty slave may be absolute sweethearts OOC, so remember to keep IC and OOC separate and not make assumptions about someone from what they show you in RP.

[08:21] Kara (aahana): @

[08:21] Elicia (faolynne): Yes Kara?

[08:22] Kara (aahana): It is not deeply sad to have to tell to those people playing a slave, that they are not forced to obey to commands in IMs? I played in many other RP environments, never, whatever my role, I have been told that I didnt have to obey to commands given in IMs by people playing a role on a more high hierarchic level than mine....

[08:24] Elicia (faolynne) smiles "I am trying to cover from all levels, those just beginning to role play who may not have a firm understanding of their rights or may need teh encouragement to feel brave enough to do so."

[08:24] Elicia (faolynne): ~~Double Brackets~~

[08:25] Elicia (faolynne): Double brackets are used to indicate that something you are saying in Local Chat is OOC. Some examples of this might be (( brb )) (or be right back, which indicates a brief absence) (( afk )) (or away from keyboard, which indicates a longer absence) etc. This can be disruptive to the role play going on around you, so please consider if your OOC comment is something that needs to be known by those around you, or if a message in an IM will work much better.

[08:25] Elicia (faolynne): Here are a few shortcuts to use when typing things in Local Chat:
Shift+Enter makes you whisper, and will be heard in a 10 meter radius around you.
Ctrl+Enter makes you shout which can be heard in a 100 meter radius around you.
Alt+Enter makes you text appear in double brackets.
And just for your general information, anything you type in local chat can be heard in a 20 meter radius, so try to keep an eye on your radar if you are talking about something you might not want overheard.

[08:26] Elicia (faolynne): How much information do you feel comfortable sharing about yourself OOC? This is something to consider and a topic I will touch upon in more detail a little bit later.

[08:26] Elicia (faolynne): ~~NPC~~

[08:27] Elicia (faolynne): What is an NPC? NPC stands for Non Player Character, so this means that they are a person, object or animal you encounter that does not have a typist actively controlling it. It is also sometimes used when, for example, a Free Woman is visiting another city, she may have an NPC guard (there may or may not be a visual representation, but the roleplay is done as if there were someone with her).

[08:27] Elicia (faolynne): Who can tell me an NPC we have here in Port Haifa?

[08:27] Kara (aahana): @

[08:28] Phaedra (lkeiser6): @@

[08:28] Elicia (faolynne): Yes Kara?

[08:29] Kara (aahana): I am not familiar with Haifa, but I think that people playing a slave should be encouraged to NPC an owner, a guard, a handler, whatver, when they visit a city, because unowned slaves dont exist in books and a traveling slave is not realistic neither. But it's just a suggestion....

[08:29] Elicia (faolynne): That is an excellent usage of an NPC, thank you Kara. *smiles*

[08:29] Elicia (faolynne): Phaedra, you are up!

[08:30] Phaedra (lkeiser6) smiles, 'As per what the question was.. Master Harold the guard is one well known one. There is Master Hack.. or Master Baits.. all the NPC's in the market area."

[08:30] Cara (clarrellae) grins

[08:31] Ineytia: Master Baits? lol cute

[08:31] Elicia (faolynne): Yes! Those are all people we encounter who don't have their strings pulled! Thank you Phaedra *smiles*

[08:31] Phaedra (lkeiser6) whispers, "He's my favy.. just dont' tell my Master!"

[08:31] Elicia (faolynne): ~~Emoting~~

[08:31] Elicia (faolynne): Emoting is how we narrate text that is not directly spoken. Emoting lets people know what we are doing, thinking and feeling in our mind; it also lets others see what is happening all around us.

[08:32] Elicia (faolynne): It can be done by starting our posts with /me or speaking as well as adding in our actions. For example,

[08:32] Elicia (faolynne) smiles cheerily to the Master, the corners of full lips lifting as she says "Greetings, Master!"

[08:32] Elicia (faolynne): Or

[08:32] Elicia (faolynne): "Greetings, Master!" she says cheerily, a small smile lifting the corners of full lips.

[08:32] Elicia (faolynne): To enrich your emoting, here are some ideas to incorporate:

[08:33] Elicia (faolynne): Where are you? Are you inside a warm a cozy Tavern? Or you outside on a wind-swept hill? Is the sun shining? Are the moons of Gor visible? What about the temperature? Does it make you sweat or are you shivering?
How are you feeling? Are you scared, or perhaps sad? Are you tired or maybe excited?

[08:33] Elicia (faolynne): How will you show this so that those you are roleplaying with will be able to sense and respond to that emotion? What can we taste, hear, feel, smell or see? Again this gives more flesh to our emotes so that it is more indepth and those around us can respond to it.

[08:34] Elicia (faolynne): You can also include the people around you. Are you in a group of all slaves? Are you the only slave amongst the Free? How do you respond in each setting. Is someone who has piqued your interest nearby? In each circumstance our responses are likely to vary.

[08:34] Elicia (faolynne): Please note though, trying to incorporate all of this into one emote might make it too long to read for some people, so pick and choose, mix it up, that will keep your roleplay fresh!

[08:34] Elicia (faolynne): Now, could you each give me an emote? Use the setting here, the people here, and try to use some of my suggestions above. Post whenever you are ready, you don't need to @ first.

[08:37] Phaedra (lkeiser6) looks around nervously, glancing over to each person in the room only for the shortest of Ihn. Quickly tiny beads of sweat form on her brow as she thinks about what happened before class. Nervously asking, "Has anyone seen Audrey around?" her voice quivering as she spoke.

[08:38] Elicia (faolynne): Excellent Phaedra!

[08:38] Phaedra (lkeiser6) winks

[08:38] Cara (clarrellae) considers the question carefully as she picks at stray threads on the rug. With a shrug of her shoulder, she says, "Maybe she went to where the bad slaves go," and then looks with a direct gaze, smiling.

[08:39] Elicia (faolynne): As you can see, the more you add to the emote, the more you give other around you to respond to!

[08:39] Ho-Ra'az (razor.hokkigai): essa skin é sua ou recebeu em Haifa?
[08:39] kisu (littlekisu): minha
[08:39] Ho-Ra'az (razor.hokkigai): ((sorry wrong window))
[08:40] Phaedra (lkeiser6) giggles ))
[08:40] Ho-Ra'az (razor.hokkigai): ((**smiles**))

[08:40] Elicia (faolynne) grins to Cara "And Mistress, you gave a perfect segue to the next topic!"

[08:40] Cara (clarrellae) proudly pays attention

[08:40] Ineytia languidly she bushes a hand across the sisal rug, distracted by the feathery swoosh of giant tarn wings just beyond the cylindrical room. Her pale eyes descend upon the others as they pose curious questions, her own brow tenses and her head cocks just a little. "Bad slaves go to the sleen pen.. " Wry grin tugging on her lips.

[08:41] Elicia (faolynne): Don't forget, humour can also be a great way to set the roleplay tone, just remember that humour is not an excuse to show a lack of respect, so if your humour has a nasty bite to it, be prepared to experience the consequences.

[08:41] Ineytia: @

[08:41] Elicia (faolynne): Yes, Ineytia?

[08:41] Ineytia: Please define "lack of respect"?

[08:42] Elicia (faolynne): Of course, for example if I were to look over to my Master and make a comment about him not emoting because he is too busy looking at the half naked slaves. That comment even followed by a *giggle* would show a lock of respect to him, it is not something that I as a slave should say without expecting him to whip me.
[08:43] Ineytia: wow what?

[08:43] Kara (aahana): Well, if you make a comment about some guy who doesn't emote, excuse me, but you are not rping.....

[08:43] Kara (aahana): I have read nothing in books about people emoting.....

[08:44] Kara (aahana): So, that would be an OOC context and in this case, you have only to follow the common rules of courtesy

[08:44] Ineytia: Ok, so you're saying that you're character -said- in brackets (dialog) or are you talking about a thought aspect to the emote?

[08:44] Ineytia: not brackets but "quotations"

[08:44] Ineytia: your*

[08:45] Phaedra (lkeiser6): @

[08:45] Kara (aahana): Is this so difficult to enforce the concept of OOC equality? Do those people who require a slave behavior in OOC so insecure RL about their dominance? Because excuse me, but it's how they look, actually...

[08:45] Marl (marlenus1previn): she was just giving an example

[08:45] Kara (aahana): A bad example, marl

[08:45] Kara (aahana): Marl* Sorry

[08:46] Ineytia: It was an example that disregarded all she had taught up to this point

[08:46] Kara (aahana): Exactly

[08:46] Ineytia: About separating OOC and IC

[08:46] Marl (marlenus1previn): have you come to deliberately disrupt a Haifa class?

[08:46] Phaedra (lkeiser6): ENOUGH

[08:46] Ineytia: Excuse me? enough?

[08:46] Ineytia: these are legitimate questions

[08:46] Marl (marlenus1previn): yes Enough

[08:46] Phaedra (lkeiser6): Yes you heard me.

[08:46] Kara (aahana): We raise interesting points, I think.

[08:46] Phaedra (lkeiser6): Stop just 2 minutes.

[08:46] Ineytia: So we don't ask questions?

[08:46] Marl (marlenus1previn): you are disrupting

[08:47] Phaedra (lkeiser6): No you don't.. you know it all and just want to disrupt class and hear yourself speak.

[08:47] Marl (marlenus1previn): If you know so much I am wondering why you came

[08:47] Ineytia: I posed a very simple question, and the answer was given and it was inadequate.

[08:47] Phaedra (lkeiser6): You are taking what she said at a literal meaning instead of thinking about it.

[08:47] Marl (marlenus1previn): exactly

[08:47] Ineytia: when she professes to be teaching to those new to RP, what she says is important.

[08:48] Ineytia: the meaning was clear

[08:48] Kara (aahana): I am a new RPer in Gor, so, I am interested by a few of these classes about Gorean RP.

[08:48] Phaedra (lkeiser6): Now I am asking you.. to either stop interrupting class or to leave the sim.

[08:48] Marl (marlenus1previn): well I suggest if you know better perhaps we can come to a class you teach ...yes?

[08:49] Ineytia: These classes are open to everyone, you advertise in groups as such

[08:49] Marl (marlenus1previn): new yet you say you play all sorts

[08:49] Ineytia: so if someone has feedback.. then you decide to not accept it?

[08:49] Ineytia: I said I play all sorts

[08:49] Ineytia: she's new

[08:49] Elicia (faolynne): The specific example itself may had been poorly worded (though the request to "say" something was done in the setting of the class room, therefore it was something I could respond to.

[08:49] Marl (marlenus1previn): how can you be new to gor ..tell me that ?

[08:49] Phaedra (lkeiser6): You are being disruptive to the class.

[08:49] Kara (aahana): New to Gorean RP, yes, it's my case. Not new to RP, for my case.

[08:49] Ineytia: who? who are you talking to? Thank you Elicia.

[08:50] Marl (marlenus1previn): I am speaking to you Ineytia

[08:50] Ineytia: Certainly not being disruptive untill all of you got defensive. I never said I was new, she did

[08:50] Marl (marlenus1previn): you said youu r/p a Free woman ans slabe etc

[08:50] Ineytia: yes

[08:50] Marl (marlenus1previn): and slave*

[08:50] Cara (clarrellae): Consider this class disrupted. You're going to have to leave now, Ineytia and Kara.

[08:50] Ineytia: I never said I was new

[08:50] Marl (marlenus1previn): even a man

[08:50] Ineytia: yes

[08:50] Ineytia: your point?

[08:51] Marl (marlenus1previn) holds his hands up you heard Phaedra

[08:51] Kara (aahana): Yes, sorry Elicia, I mean only to participate, not to disrupt. Can you continue please?

[08:51] Marl (marlenus1previn): sorry Cara

[08:52] Ineytia: it's all good, I can go when asked

[08:52] Cara (clarrellae): You are asked, please leave now.

[08:52] Elicia (faolynne): I appreciate the concern with my example, Kara, but plese allow me a chance to respond when you have one *smiles*

[08:52] Ineytia: one more thing I'll say:Have you ever heard the term "The medium is the message?". That's what comes to mind sitting here. I find the information presented in this class to be well put together, and I cannot say anything against the content. But what I am seeing is a class that talks about IC and OOC, and yet the pupils are being treated as if they are IC, but spoken to/educated about a clearly OOC topic. There would never be a class on Gor about how to distinguish IC and OOC.... You see how the medium is the more important message here?

[08:52] Kara (aahana): Yes of course, but if we give inputs that go against some culture, is it possible to not be accused to disrupt?

[08:53] Kara (aahana): And good comment from Ineytia, I must say....

Ejected from land

I'm just going to add this as well. The instructor was nice enough to give my friend a copy of the entire class that we were being ejected from. And as in the previous chat log, this here is what again catches my eye the most:

~~Bad Serve Night~~

Bad Serve Night is a great opportunity to let your inner comedian out, and also an amazing opportunity to practice and expand upon your emoting skill set.

The slaves on a night such as this are allowed to serve with less than our usual grace and expectation of perfection. You are allowed (within the bounds of staying true to the role you play) to express emotions that are otherwise expected to stay firmly planted inside you kajira brain. You can be distracted, impatient, even clumsy!

Please note: This is not a chance to be rude or disrespectful!! You must always remember to show a proper level of respect, but you can still have fun. Did I mention: This is not a chance to be rude or disrespectful, it is really important to remember this! Which is why I am mentioning it twice!

Are you telling me the typist to behave? Because in this context I have seriously no idea what's in character and what's out of character on this sim anymore.

Also... On the section Entering and Exiting Roleplay:

Consider: Are there two Free obviously engaged in a discussion, at that point you need to decide if your presence is a good idea or not, but certainly do not greet and interrupt the flow of their role play, rather kneel quietly if you decide to remain. Are the people happy, sad, angry? This will dictate how you speak and act. It is NOT appropriate to "bounce in happily" if they are all quite somber.

Now, how about exiting role play? If you are a slave, and in service or the presence of the Free (ie. you have been noticed by them in role play) you need to beg to be excused.

quite clearly, not only are they guilty of propagating "onlinisms", they are guilty of negating the slave character to the bottom of the totem pole. "Shhh don't interrupt, the "free" are RPing, dear."
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Re: Do "Online-isms" Add to RP?

Postby Cassie » Thu Nov 21, 2013 1:35 am

I know I cannot hear tone of voices or faces when reading a virtual game but it's pretty clear she was very much acting with a gorean mentality even in the OOC context. While I generally don't care and reply to people calling me slut or master in an IM with an ironic "waz up dude" I don't expect others to abide by their RL setting but this is class... this is teaching people, should not even be questioned weather to be gorean or not.

Not everyone has the capacity of removing their own sentiments and teach people as objectively as possible. Maybe the woman worded wrongly... maybe she is clueless but yeah perfect example why reading a fucking book should come first. Norman already is puzzling as it is.
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Re: Do "Online-isms" Add to RP?

Postby Mynerva » Thu Nov 21, 2013 7:17 am

Mat wrote:I think that onlineisms are a good thing as it adds to the diversity of the rp environment.

In reality - they accomplished the exact opposite. Onlineisms were especially taught to slave role players - and they made everyone THE SAME. The same behavior, serves, even answers to questions were expected out of slave role players. Horrible! Mind numbingly boring! Every time I played a slave and found myself in a situation where the 10 step serve, the tea ceremony, or the perfect answers to a set of questions were expected of me - I wanted to stab someone in the eye :fleeflee:
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Re: Do "Online-isms" Add to RP?

Postby Anarch Allegiere » Thu Nov 21, 2013 7:54 am

Mat wrote:I think that onlineisms are a good thing as it adds to the diversity of the rp environment.

There's a bit of a difference between onlineisms and cultural diversity in my opinion. I would appreciate much of the latter, but it seems very hard (especially in majority of BtB sims) to establish such things because people will be very quick to point their fingers and be like: "This isn't how it was in the books, and it wasn't mentioned anywhere either!"

A lot of people tend to learn the genre in the sim they start out in, and often this causes problems when those people travel to other sims and expect the same behaviour of all the roles there. It's somewhat of a problem when the majority of sims have all the basics wrong, people 'learn' the genre there and then spread out to other sims.

The minority of sims that do not practice certain onlineisms tend to get rejected or stamped or regarded as GE or ungorean sims by the rest of the unthinking majority.

This also creates somewhat of the amusing situation where roleplay oriented people that come from GE sims seem to have much less issues with handling actual book-themed gorean roleplay and RP scenes than the majority of dumbfucks that come from BtB sims.

Disclaimer: When I'm referring to the majority of dumbfucks of BtB sims I'm referring to the average flexi-skirt crowd that populates BtB Gor and those people generally do not read these forums.
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Re: Do "Online-isms" Add to RP?

Postby Glaucon » Thu Nov 21, 2013 8:48 am

@ Acosmist:

Hmmm... I read through that thing. And I felt a bit bad for the one teaching the class (Elicia). Because she was doing her best (and it didn't look as if she was the one ejecting you). And to me, it did seem like you and the other person were being overly critical, waiting for her to make the mistakes you were anticipating.

Frankly, what she was teaching could have been far worse. At least she did teach basic IC and OOC separation. That makes her class a lot more 'enlightened' than other classes I have witnessed in the past. And she did respond to your corrections. You pounced on one, but that one was probably, as she put it, a matter of a poor choice of words.

Nevertheless, it is clear that the mentality of that sim (and her's) was one of a imperfect IC/OOC separation. She clear is what she herself would call an 'immersion'-player. Which is the wrong term, because someone playing a character that is very different from their RL self can still strive for immersive RP, the two things are separate. But she is what we have been calling a 'soul-player' here. And obviously one that wants to address people OOCly in a way that doesn't differ much from how she normally addresses them ICly. (The whole thing about 'respect', I guess). And so she doesn't quite 'get' the other side of the spectrum that well and makes mistakes about it.

Now, I could be wrong, but I do suspect that the majority of players in SL Gor are either soul-players (so, someone playing a 'Master' being a guy that tends towards the dom-side, and a slave being a woman tending towards the sub-side, for example) or people that 'play a character' both ICly AND OOCly (like someone pretending to person OOCly that is close to the character they play ICly, even if they are not, in RL). These people tend to be quite happy being treated OOCly in line with how they might expect to be treated ICly. They might be naturally inclined to mix the two. The slave that kneels in an OOC marketplace. The 'Master' that acts all bossy and entitled to great respect of his opinions when he speaks in a group talking OOCly.

That common 'mixing' is not necessarily 'wrong'. It just is. I suspect that in places like Gor, there is always going to be something like it. The same sort of thing exists in other places that have a dom/sub divide. It may grate for those that are used to advanced RP etiquette (which usually comes with people observing a stricter IC/OOC separation, because more 'advanced' RP does require that people are well aware of what is IC and what is OOC), but it is probably way too much to ask that everyone embrace this attitude fully. At least, the teacher of this class was teaching it. That should count for something.

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