Thanks for reminding me about the Kaelus/Hochburg war, I'd forgotten that detail. Hochburg was basically a Lifestyle sim who took GE gamers out on their raids, whilst their own sim's rules forbade any GE players from raiding them.
So far as I recall it that war didn't end well. Poor Theoden, he does put in a lot of effort into his schemes. We had IC encounters back in the day, usually violent and IM-rage-filled encounters(I like anyone who can rage without being a girl about it), but he brings something to the Gorean scene and it was always fun doing battle with him.
However, tell Theoden to stop playing an Easy-Mode Red Caste
Then he'll see what it means to be swamped under IC appointments all-fucking-night! It's like you tune into SL at the day's end and trawl through a list of virtual work.
Red Castes always have time for slaves, they do nothing else!
No, Hochburg was not a lifestyle sim. Not -this- Hochburg. It had been opened by a little bunch of ex-Trevians, ex-Clearchus, and I had never seen these people enforce any kind of lifestyle.
I know nothing about the GE players they would have taken in their raids (I didn't play in Hochburg). I remember, during the war Kaelus/Hochburg, that some Hoch allies caused troubles. Kaelus was winning and troubles just increased. We dealt with a lot of immature people. Nothing unusual in SL Gor, after all.
I'm not getting what you mean with these IC appointments and I prefer people who can rage without being a boy about it. You always find an agreement with people "girl-ragging", they don't put their big ego in the middle of the discussion.
Tantus wrote:Red Castes always have time for slaves, they do nothing else!
That would be the case in a perfect SL Gor. But actually, warriors of SL Gor, like most SL Gor men, spend more time courting a FW they will FC, then fuck as if she was a slave....
Tantus wrote:I've been saying it since 2009, back when you were still roleplaying on Lifestyle sims.
These sims don't label them as lifestyles. So far, the Gorean sims where I played since 2010:
Cardonicus, Telus, Fields of Cardonicus, Rovere, Kailani (admin), Tarnwald (co-owner), Turia (admin), Saphronicus, Treve, Cyprianus (co-owner), Oasis of the Red Scimitar (admin), Malignance - Tales of Port Kar, Ko-ro-ba - Towers of Morning, Tarnwald, Kaelus (co-owner), 3 Ar sims (cali then Nero), Illyros (admin), Khalida.
I think I never really played in sims that were more lifestyle than your Thentis from 2010, actually. I don't count the bunch of sims I randomly visited with friends, where we were looking for a decent place.
Tantus wrote:You're welcome to your own definitions. Conservative, far-right governments usually take a hostile view towards understanding the dissidents' concerns, they have a need to maintain authority through suppressing free thought. People like you are dangerous, you're afraid of having your truths questioned.
A solution was proposed, you haven't proven it works on high traffic sims with an endless train of slaves arriving every week. Jasmine was a busy sim earlier this year, they held 40-60 avatars on sim for consecutive months.
I remember, the second Ar opened by cali, was high traffic, allowed slave players to pick the role they wanted, with a NPC owner. There was not endless train of slaves arriving each week.
In fact, you have to choose what kind of slave players you want in your sim. Mature people, able to take care of their RP, their story who don't need to be "babysitted", or the opposite, the noobs, the cookie cutters and other doormats who are lost if not told what to RP?
My very -liberal- system leads to a somewhat natural selection..... When conservative, far-right kennels welcome every slave player they are be able to control and who are willing to worship their lame slavers as well.
Jasmine, with its 60K traffic for months, was probably the busiest sim that has ever existed in SL Gor. And still, it closed. As Anarch explained, you always need to keep people interested with something big, new and exciting. Problem: Your admins spent a lot of time and energy on this issue, sometimes at the expense of their own RP and stories. After months, some will face a burn out, lose their motivation, etc. And players go seek excitment elsewhere, their own motivation and interest having vanished as well.
Tantus wrote:I'd never waste my time on such an effort for the sake of Sais, being banned by them was nothing new. The Trade Alliance roleplay happened because a friend of mine joined us in Tarnwald, she easily seduces men into signing what she wants and that makes for an excellent envoy.
We travelled around Gor and formed an alliance, the roleplay happened because she's into it and I like people who put themselves out there and make a personal effort, meeting new people, seducing them into signing over treaties with no intercourse involved. How can one woman be so seductive? Usually without knowing she is and I just exploited her. This is how I treat my friends.
Feel free to post anything I wrote of the alliance being in exclusive opposition to Sais. Perhaps in GC we had a 'fuck Sais' attitude, it's nothing unusual.
As I said, you were not so discret about your secret agenda. And don't ask me the logs. Be serious, it was in 2013... As for trade alliances RP, they tend to be boring. I like people who focus their RP efforts in the sim they joined, who RP with the people of this sim, create stories in this sim, instead of bringing their RP and traffic to other places. There is seldom thrilling stories to expect from these trade alliances RP, too, especially when these alliances are respected......
Tantus wrote:Absolutely ask anything you need. I haven't been so intrusive into your roleplaying past, it's only when you make outlandish claims that I felt some perspective was necessary.
As a non-combatant, I don't think you'll appreciate the meaning of being armed in Gor during that era. And I don't say this to be rude, but Gor was part-game, part-roleplaying, a very hostile environment to roleplay in and you were always listening for the sound of movement or weapons being drawn. This constant state of readiness was the cost for being armed and you could argue it's not roleplaying, but I preferred that level of immersion.
The only time we were caught out, was with Vladimir and I sparring on our sim, when 10 Black Talons landed on our docks then charged up and downed us on the field. They were not a bad group but we probably would have defeated them 10v2 if we weren't distracted, so they took us home and killed us. That was the Gor Life. That's how you learned to be more attentive and not go crying to some mod for new rules, and more, and more, until the danger is gone.
I was sarcastic... But see, I encounter lifestylers, you encounter cheaters... If I used your own arguments, I could question your choice of people and groups you choose to RP with, as you did with me.
Also, in 2007, I played a female outlaw (Shadow Outlaws) after I stopped playing a slave (tired of being treated like a sub in OOC). I raided, I fought, etc. Was fun, combat was everywhere. Even slave players could often wear a dagger. Gor in 2007 was still very lifestyle with almost no IC/OOC separation, but became more part-game than part-roleplaying. What you commonly get in actual GE sims. I can understand better than you think, your concerns about a combat environment.
But in Cyprianus, in 2011, we were already more into a full RP context (which I tried to enforce even more, with little success, as I said). We had, so, 2 guys (both assassins), involved in a scene, reading and typing posts (not sparring), when suddenly, some pew pew imbecile (scribe) falls on them like the misery on the poor world with a 40% damage sword. Excuse me, we could hardly speak of a context making sense in terms of realism and plausibility.
But I confess, totally acceptable in terms of gaming. That was where I disagreed with my co-owners, I wanted a sim with a strong emphasis put on role-play, not on gaming. Epic fail.
Tantus wrote:One of the pitfalls of roleplaying a gladiator was it restricted your access to the outside world, we roleplayed among ourselves and those who came to visit us.
Oh, so, I misunderstood you. I guess you told in a previous post that your char became the wealthiest one in Capua (or my memory sucks, I didn't get my dose of caffeine yet). I figured it had happened after a series of IC events where you would had passed throught different levels of the town's hierachy in order to raise in society, plotting schemes, making the right alliances, etc etc.
You are prompt to criticize the political RP genre, Tantus, but at the end, have you ever RP such a story...?
Tantus wrote:It seems like you only encounter mambas/torvie hybrids when you're out in Gor.
A good roleplayer is someone who invests their talent into the wider community on a sim level.
On a personal level, their emotes open opportunities for the other player, they can build tension and make their partner sit back and actually think, before responding. They understand roleplaying is much like a RL conversation and how to keep people engaged.
Compared to someone who writes really well, but is too invested into themselves, every emote is centred onto their character, their past, their traits, their family history. Initially players will be impressed by the quality of emoting, then soon realise this person is only interested in themselves.
A good roleplayer isn't necessarily a good writer, they're someone who engages their partner and makes them question what they would actually do in that situation. Absolutely can find people who are both, good writers and roleplayers, but these people are rare.
Some of my memorable encounters were with people who weren't amazing writers, they were just a lot of fun to roleplay with.
Tantus, have you often met, in SL Gor, IC families whose all members shared the same home stone, all offspring claimed their father's caste, whatever men or women? People who can keep the same home stone and caste for their character, over years when they refuse to create a new char? You know like me that people whose character have parents from different cultures are very common in SL Gor. And it's BS. I remember even having visited Southern cities in SL Gor, where you could meet more Torvie natives than in Torvi sims. For a period, especially after the release of Swordmen, several sims were invaded by Pani. Not to mention those people follow a non sense course in the Gorean Campus, then, register their Tuchuk char as scribe in a city... Just the average population of SL Gor. Because they don't really get the cultural aspect of Gor. They RP a Gorean character with a Earth mentality.
Also, you said in a previous post:
Tantus wrote:So we don't disagree on the dire state of SL Gor, but I do object to throwing all Gorean Roleplayers into that Lifestyle bracket.
But you keep arguing that I only joined lifestyle sims, label "lifestyle" a sim like Khalida... On one hand, you deny that most people in SL Gor have difficulties at distancing themselves from their character and embrace Gorean values in OOC (even if they are not real life lifestylers), and on the other hand, you claim that most sims are lifestyle oriented... Sorry Tantus, it's not very coherent.
About the definition of a good role players... Erm, by your standards, the RPers who are not investing their talent in "the wider community on a sim level" wouldn't be good RPers? What of those who spend much of their time out of their sim and seek RP in another? Often, they claim they are doing this for the sole purpose of bringing RP to the sim they initially joined. Which seldom happens. Personally, I tend to think they only seek their own contentment.
People who are invested into themselves stay alone. You cannot center a scene just on your own character and expect to keep people interested. It's not bad to give a hint about this character's past and history, etc, but it's all about context. In some scenes, it will add something interesting. In other scenes, it will be totally useless.
For me, a good RPer is not necessarily the one who has the best writing, turns his sentences in the best academic style (although, it can be very pleasant to read). But since my English is not flawess, I would be ridiculous to expect a professional writing from my RP partners, anyway.
A good RPer, from my point of vieux, is the one who can adjust to the context, expresses emotionally his character in a way that will make you feel these emotions, then immerse you totally in the story. They also make you become an active protagonist in the book they are writing, making you a co-writer.
I think we can agree on this last point.
But this purpose cannot be achevied with an one liner.