The Annual "Gor Sims" Update!

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Anarch Allegiere
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Re: The Annual "Gor Sims" Update!

Postby Anarch Allegiere » Fri Aug 11, 2017 9:14 pm

I always found that the more I read and understood the books the harder it became to actually -enjoy- role playing in SL Gor. I can look past the way some people dress, but when it really starts getting fucked up is when important central pillars start being opposed and denied.

Getting called 'weird' IC because you portray a character that prefers the company of slave-girls over free women.
Getting insulted (IC and OOC) because you: A. share your slave-girls with other men or B. have more than one slave-girl.

These are just the few examples I remember straight from the top of my head, but usually when I RP in SL Gor it quickly becomes a whole washlist of reasons (warrior codes, merchant law, ...) as to why I start banging my head against the wall in frustration. Involving such misguided characters in your RP scenes can kill the entire immersion and buzz of everything else you've been RPing. So I can definitely understand why some people become a whole lot more 'exclusive' and 'clique-ish' when they RP in SL Gor - but RPing the same few people all the time can get dull too, you need regular 'outside' contact to keep RP interesting and fresh - but if that just becomes an exercise in frustration every time you try it, you'll just realize that RPing in SL Gor just doesn't 'work' anymore.

SL Gor has developed it's own 'dumbed down' culture - which is very different from the world in the books. The books who oddly enough, allow for a lot more creative and diverse characters. It's just a really weird world of slave-girls must be personality-less / story-less / sex-less waitresses and where violence and complex social dynamics are taboo.

There is just too large of a critical mass of role players in SL Gor who don't 'get it'. (And then we didn't even touch on the lack of separating IC and OOC sufficiently yet, just do a bit of conflict RP and you'll see how quickly people don't get it. IC conflict becomes a reason to hate each other's guts apparently - perpetuated by TS and Discord servers full of people OOC hating other groups and sims).

All that is the reason why I'm elitist and clique-ish in SL Gor, but probably one of the most inclusive RP-ers in other genres. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
Tantus
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Re: The Annual "Gor Sims" Update!

Postby Tantus » Sat Aug 12, 2017 8:14 am

Authenticity is near-impossible to achieve in Gorean roleplay when the world is so alien. Most other roleplaying sims follow familiar settings from Earth, even futuristic Sci-Fi roleplay has a lower bar of entry than Gor.

So I get the immersion breaking events too, I've had to look away from the screen and pretend I didn't just read that emote. But it only matters to me that the person is trying to improve their roleplay and understanding of the world.

Then that elusive path to perfection has prematurely killed sims too, when sim owners are overlooking active roleplayers for IC leadership, in favour of burned-out friends from the past. It happens on any sim, and as a consequence the active roleplayers move on, and the inactive caste-leads remain inactive.

Northern sims have fallen into a rut too, of having the 'It' couple leading their village into a patriarchal setting. Maybe it was Ironhall(I never roleplayed there) or Amhas(Didn't roleplay there either), but Torolf and Maisy definitely did set the tone for successive Torvie sims . They're both interesting roleplayers and what they achieved in Amhas shouldn't become the standard for every Northern sim to replicate, but it is what people try to do. They haven't understood it's not only the IC leadership, but the timing of the sim, the roleplayers who settled there and everything else too, that makes a sim what it was.

Everyone in Gorean RP is chasing after perfection, trying to recreate past successes, trying to make their Dream Team of washed out roleplayers function again. SL Gor is like the cinema, you don't watch a movie every week, but pick your moments of when to go in, and knowing the months when there's nothing worth viewing.

In 2017 the only movie on my list is Blade Runner 2! My Gorean roleplay happens once a year or less too, that's how long it takes for another sim to come along with the right mix of roleplayers to inspire you.
Last edited by Tantus on Sat Aug 12, 2017 8:53 am, edited 1 time in total.
Tantus
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Re: The Annual "Gor Sims" Update!

Postby Tantus » Sat Aug 12, 2017 8:36 am

Sasi wrote:Tantus, it's not some shadows sims... Read the group chats, read people's profiles... In SL Gor, most people speak of themselves not in terms of role-players, but as if they were their character. They introduce themselves as warriors, slaves, free women, etc. I never saw a role play environment where people so much suck at distancing themselves from their characters....

Also, you didn't understand my previous comment. I never expected that free characters should accomodate slaves into their role play as I appreciate that they don't come ruin a scene I'm playing with another slave to send my character serve visitors potentially new sim members to the local inn.

All that I expect is that these people respect the whole Gorean culture, where FW don't display their curves, features and hair, where men lust after slave girls, show deference to FW but consider them as rather useless in terms of pleasure, where FW don't befriend kajirae but hate them, are jealous of them and where slaves fear FW like hell. What you see in the Gorean books, chapter after chapter.

Because yes, the slave role becomes meaningless when it happens (and it happens everywhere, in every sim). Unlike you enjoy playing a waitress in the background of some scene. And it happens in the most populated sims....


The consistently popular BTB sims tend to be the trashiest, where everything that isn't Gor is happening. What can you do about it, but avoid them.

And I get the nuisance it must be for anyone roleplaying a scene and being interrupted, but it doesn't only happen with slave characters. Any Free person in a responsible position knows about interruptions. The people I roleplay with have laughed about the moments my character is trying to enter his IC home, when he's stopped by one person needing something, then another, then another comes along. I've literally had ques of people outside my IC home, all needing something and then I need to log with no personal RP done.

I know red caste players who've been weighed under all of the RP dumped on them, that instead of sending relevant RP their way, I take care of it myself. I know physicians who're equally bored of random Gorean goon bursting into the infirmary and demanding his slave's examination with no consideration to her ongoing RP.

And all of this is insignificant compared to the RP load an IC leader faces,when everyone on the sim wants to roleplay with them and everything they roleplay is about the sim.

So... I'm not understanding why it's such a burden for a pair of slave-players, who're out in a public place, to be engaged in Roleplay. And so what if it's mundane, we all have to shovel shit in Gor, no matter our roles. And there's no reason why those girls can't carry out their task with some flirty flair and flourish, so the men reading it will make a definitive note of finding them later. Every opportunity is an RP opening to bigger things when you treat it that way. I don't meet with people and hear their IC issues out of kindness, I do so because somewhere along the line I'm going to call in favours, many of them, all at once. And get bigger things done :twisted:
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Qingwen
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Re: The Annual "Gor Sims" Update!

Postby Qingwen » Sat Aug 12, 2017 9:45 am

I'd come back to SL RP if someone did a good Blade Runner themed sim.. I always wanted to play a replicant! 8-)
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Sasi
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Re: The Annual "Gor Sims" Update!

Postby Sasi » Sun Aug 13, 2017 6:35 pm

Anarch Allegiere wrote:I always found that the more I read and understood the books the harder it became to actually -enjoy- role playing in SL Gor. I can look past the way some people dress, but when it really starts getting fucked up is when important central pillars start being opposed and denied.

Getting called 'weird' IC because you portray a character that prefers the company of slave-girls over free women.
Getting insulted (IC and OOC) because you: A. share your slave-girls with other men or B. have more than one slave-girl.

These are just the few examples I remember straight from the top of my head, but usually when I RP in SL Gor it quickly becomes a whole washlist of reasons (warrior codes, merchant law, ...) as to why I start banging my head against the wall in frustration. Involving such misguided characters in your RP scenes can kill the entire immersion and buzz of everything else you've been RPing. So I can definitely understand why some people become a whole lot more 'exclusive' and 'clique-ish' when they RP in SL Gor - but RPing the same few people all the time can get dull too, you need regular 'outside' contact to keep RP interesting and fresh - but if that just becomes an exercise in frustration every time you try it, you'll just realize that RPing in SL Gor just doesn't 'work' anymore.

SL Gor has developed it's own 'dumbed down' culture - which is very different from the world in the books. The books who oddly enough, allow for a lot more creative and diverse characters. It's just a really weird world of slave-girls must be personality-less / story-less / sex-less waitresses and where violence and complex social dynamics are taboo.

There is just too large of a critical mass of role players in SL Gor who don't 'get it'. (And then we didn't even touch on the lack of separating IC and OOC sufficiently yet, just do a bit of conflict RP and you'll see how quickly people don't get it. IC conflict becomes a reason to hate each other's guts apparently - perpetuated by TS and Discord servers full of people OOC hating other groups and sims).

All that is the reason why I'm elitist and clique-ish in SL Gor, but probably one of the most inclusive RP-ers in other genres. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯



Exactly that, my problem... I read the 34 books to make my RP more realistic and authentic (in the sense of what is described in the books, of course), I discovered that the books didn't limit our creativity, all the opposite when were depicted situations that I didn't imagine, that in SL Gor would have been deemed impossible.
And then, I realized that people could never really forget their Earth mentality when they started playing, that they came with their RL morals.

Cassie, actually, if you search a bit on the MP, you will find many gowns which don't hug the woman's ass, which don't have a corset that will enhance the curves. Plus, several designers sells modesty layers you can mix and match as well with other accessories. And the "burqas" I made myself sell well and are elegant. I consider you can easily play a FW without having to wear a dress that enhance your curves better than a latex suit. When some FW have bouncing big boobs and a top that even underline the shape of the nipples, the only consequences which should follow would be that men send these women home if they share their home stone, collar them if not. And it never happens. When you play a role, you have some effort to make on the appearance of your avatar. If you play a FW and want your avatar being sexy, consider playing a slave girl instead.

Yes Tantus, I know you can be interrupted as well when you play a free. I played a FW for years, kajira being a quite new experience to me. But there is a difference. When you play a slave, people think they can interrupt your scene and send you away. As FW, I played with slave girls, and I had already experienced the problem: A FW or FM approaches, then, send the slave go to serve the visitors who just arrived. It's just not acceptable. Not to mention when you are playing a scene with a FW in a quiet place and suddenly, a FW crosses the whole sim and start emoting something melodramatic to get the man's attention (cuz in SL-Gor, a man showing interest to a slave is an oddity. In SL Gor, it's FW with whom men must flirt and lust after).

A physician who is asked a slave exam while he is busy RP, may, in character, send the nuisance elsewhere. A slave player will be forced to tell in IMs "I'm playing a scene I enjoy, find someone else for this other scene". And will likely be answered "You're a slave, you must obey"... Because most people in SL Gor don't separate IC and OOC and don't understand there is a player behind the slave. These lame people don't understand that playing a FM or FW doesn't give you rights to control the rp of slave players.

So, hopefully will you be able to understand the burden of enjoying a scene and having it trashed by idiots who think it's just the normal thing to do. Not to mention those who can't get that 2 slave players may enjoy RPing with each other instead of going to play a waitress with some boring dudes to the local inn. Believe me, in these cases, I prefer no RP at all. The last time it happened to me (some one liner dude who wanted a slave girl to serve himself and his FC in the inn), I did say nothing OOC. I followed, he asked a paga and water for his wench. And I typed a paragraph when I sent them a NPC girl, owned by the Inn, because my character being not owned by this establishment, I knew that I would be kicked off from the kitchen. Then, I exited the scene.
Now, I would not even bother doing that, I would just send an IM and don't give a fuck to the OOC or IC reaction.
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Re: The Annual "Gor Sims" Update!

Postby Tantus » Thu Aug 17, 2017 11:07 am

It all comes back to roleplayer responsibility, being aware of the sim you're on and those in your proximity. By the look of avatars and their profiles, it's not difficult to separate the roleplayers from the creeps.

SL Gor goes through its phases, at times you won't find a single Roleplaying sim. And then a couple will open at once, so pick your sims and your moments of returning into Gorean RP. I personally had interesting times at the current Lara, and previously in Laura Outpost. And before that? I'd say Tarnwald which was many years ago. So there are large gaps between one legitimate roleplaying sim to the next.
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Re: The Annual "Gor Sims" Update!

Postby Tantus » Mon Aug 21, 2017 9:43 am

After a promising start, Mhirdrun is on its way out too. I'll post the message from Phiona which I feel resonates with many popular RP sims of recent times:

► Show Spoiler


Now there's an expectation on sim owners to provide more than just a nice build to roleplay in.

I made a character for Mhirdrun and did interact some, but didn't have the time to really roleplay. It was an excellent build with six distinct environments(town, farmlands, woodland pass, forest, snowy fortress and the crag/underground city), where you could always find roleplay on any level of the sim. The avatars were better dressed than your average fantasy sim too.

Despite everything on offer, the idea of developing your character over time is not enough any longer. Everyone wants to enter as the central character, with successes, thrilling content, daily dramatics all spoonfed to them without throwing in much effort themselves.
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Tamar Luminos
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Re: The Annual "Gor Sims" Update!

Postby Tamar Luminos » Mon Aug 21, 2017 3:06 pm

Well, damn- I never heard anything about Mhirdrun, which is a shame because I've always liked Phiona's sims and would have liked to have checked it out. Ah well.

I've checked Lara out, nice build, usually has a few people on, but not a whole lot of people out in public where you can interact with them, least not when I've been in. Going to give it a bit longer, really would love to play in a Gor sim again. I go too long and usually miss my old favorite RP setting, despite the fact that I've always had a devil of a time finding decent RP in Gor sims.

Convergence (supernatural/urban/modern) usually has decent RP at most of the times I've been in. There's a couple of new WoD sims, will have to look up their SLurLs and I've heard talk about a Shadowrun sim opening but don't know the name or location. Remnants of Earth is still chugging along and I'll likely poke my head back in there when I'm feeling cyberpunky. I've tried GoT a few times, love the books and really want to love the setting but I've been bored out of my skull there every time I've tried- I think I just don't have the patience for the "slow burn" type of RP most GoT sims have, and don't have the time to put in on a slow build RP plot anyway. I tend to be more "drop in, find a fun scene for an hour or two, drop out for a few days" sort of player now. If I can string things together to get a larger, longer term plot, fantastic, but generally I find people have already moved on and advanced the plot by the time I'm able to get back on. But it means I greatly enjoy those pleasantly surprising scenes that come out of nowhere.

Anybody else got any good sims to check out? I'm even willing to scope out a GE sim if they actually have some RP mixed in with their pew.
"...to take truth for granted is not to know it. Truth not won is not possessed. We are not entitled to truths for which we have not fought." --- (Marauders of Gor, p.7)
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Re: The Annual "Gor Sims" Update!

Postby Qingwen » Mon Aug 21, 2017 11:36 pm

Tantus wrote:After a promising start, Mhirdrun is on its way out too. I'll post the message from Phiona which I feel resonates with many popular RP sims of recent times:


Thanks for posting that. I didn't know Mhirdrun was gone but I can't say I'm surprised. It seemed to be trying to do too much for too many from the beginning. I had a couple nice RPs there but lacked the time to devote to it.

I think she hits on something important here:

"Ultimately, Mhirdrun was, not unlike Llorkh, a victim of its own success, staff in-fighting fueled by understaffing, and inexperience in managing large and diverse crowds that came primarily from three separate genres: seeking faction warfare, adventure, and social/political intrigue. Each of these groups wanted very different things from Mhirdrun in an environment that had initially been designed for something far smaller scale.."

The vision of the place was unclear (as are many other sims). I realised I am in the "adventure" camp, partly due to preference and partly time factors (jumping in for a quick scene is easier than long-drawn stories, though I like continuity in character). Faction warfare and socio/political intrigue are not very interesting to me, beyond a general background to the setting that may or may not affect a scene.

Perhaps a lesson there for future sim owners - know which target group to aim for, as there is obviously a customer base for all.
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Re: The Annual "Gor Sims" Update!

Postby Leah » Tue Aug 22, 2017 9:28 pm

Tamar Luminos wrote:Well, damn- I never heard anything about Mhirdrun, which is a shame because I've always liked Phiona's sims and would have liked to have checked it out. Ah well.


Same. I loved Llorkh. :-\
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