The Gorean ideal of beauty

[Perse]

@Perse
The first with Shakira not so much or JLo

I'd defo agree about JLo being too toned, and in that picture of Shakira she *looks* hard, or toned, but I think her torso is just overworked from all that dancing. Just like one's abs/biceps/whatevs look their hardest after a workout. Cuz her tummy usually looks soft and curved, like this!:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DUT5rEU6pqM

[Kaitlin]

@Perse
The first with Shakira not so much or JLo

I'd defo agree about JLo being too toned, and in that picture of Shakira she *looks* hard, or toned, but I think her torso is just overworked from all that dancing. Just like one's abs/biceps/whatevs look their hardest after a workout. Cuz her tummy usually looks soft and curved, like this!:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DUT5rEU6pqM

Agreed! Much better...but makes me wonder about something...if the belly dance type movements contribute to having that curved belly in addition to genetics. Every belly dancer I have seen has that.

[Perse]

...but makes me wonder about something...if the belly dance type movements contribute to having that curved belly in addition to genetics. Every belly dancer I have seen has that.

I think it has to be. A friend I grew up with had a naturally athletic body when we were kids; the kind of body where she had a 'natural' six-pack without ever working out, and super toned arms. She began belly dancing and doing burlesque shows after college and lo and behold - a pooch. I've never really thought to ask her, but I'm gonna and I'll get back to you! I'm curious now too.

[Glaucon]

Pretty much agreed with the posts above, except that I think the gorean slave would be a little more in accordance to the 'fit-look' than some of you think. A little bit, at least. After all, it is clear that they aren't allowed to be fat (generally speaking) and they do get training that can be straining. They aren't sitting on their asses all day. Plus, they may dance, as well. As for Shakira... ýes, she has a bit of arm-muscle. Maybe her build would be rather close to what I imagine a panther girl's to be (more that than Boris Vanlo's heavily muscled female Arnolds on the book cover).

And I agree... there is mention of that 'belly' thing. So, I guess not the 'ideal' belly that renders the belly into little more than a slight tube around the spine. Yet, at the same time, how large does a belly have to be to be called a belly? I don't think Norman was typically thinking about anything that we (except maybe people working in the modelling/fashion industry) would consider 'fat'.

All in all, though... even though it is clear that there is a difference between the most notable 'beauty ideal' and Gor's/Norman's, I still feel that the 'beauty' described in the books is more 20th century west than anything else (which is only to be expected, of course).

[Mynerva]

I think it has to be. A friend I grew up with had a naturally athletic body when we were kids; the kind of body where she had a 'natural' six-pack without ever working out, and super toned arms. She began belly dancing and doing burlesque shows after college and lo and behold - a pooch. I've never really thought to ask her, but I'm gonna and I'll get back to you! I'm curious now too.

Maybe all that dancing made her very very hungry

[Syndel]

Yep, belly dancing definitely makes a pooch appear.

[Caranda]

I'm pretty sure the Gorean ideal of beauty has a lot to do with JN's personal ideal of beauty.

It's plain he has a fondness for shorter women with curvier figures but there are also slaves in the books who are described as both slender and very beautiful so his tastes are not confined to any one particular type.

I don't agree that "plus-size" models, or at least the fatter ones, represent a JN/Gorean ideal of beauty, except perhaps for some men of the Tahari who seem to have a thing for overweight women. Whenever we are given details of heights, weights, measurements in the books of slaves considered to be very attractive they turn out to be pretty petite and well within normal weight ranges - for example, Doreen in Dancer is repeatedly described as curvy, with ample boobage, curvy hips and a belly and her BMI (which I know is an imperfect measurement) comes out as 21.

The other thing that seems to be a JN fixation is the high regard given to auburn hair. It comes up again and again in the books as the ideal hair colour. I suspect JN must have had his heart broken by a girl with auburn hair.

[Kaitlin]

I suspect JN must have had his heart broken by a girl with auburn hair.

Or his slave has auburn hair.

[Adlai]

I just lost an hour of my life to J Lo and Shakira on youtube and I'm holding this thread entirely responsible. LOL

[Glaucon]

I just lost an hour of my life to J Lo and Shakira on youtube and I'm holding this thread entirely responsible. LOL

'Losing' is such a relative term.