Black Caste declining in standards, debate!

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Tamar Luminos
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Re: Black Caste declining in standards, debate!

Postby Tamar Luminos » Thu Sep 10, 2015 10:54 pm

Anarch Allegiere wrote:Well, that is where things get somewhat absurd to me. It's not really 'taking a kill' if you are back the next day and explain: “'tis but a scratch”.


Well, that's what separates the good roleplayers from the bad. The good will post a reasonable reaction to a well worded attack. The bad will channel The Black Knight from Monty Python's The Holy Grail. :lol:
"...to take truth for granted is not to know it. Truth not won is not possessed. We are not entitled to truths for which we have not fought." --- (Marauders of Gor, p.7)
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Re: Black Caste declining in standards, debate!

Postby Harlequin » Thu Sep 10, 2015 11:02 pm

Good players end up fucked up, scarred, and otherwise mangled or show emotional and social reactions to the near death experience.
Bad ones show up the next day or week acting like they're awesome and you're weak because you couldn't kill them.
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Qingwen
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Re: Black Caste declining in standards, debate!

Postby Qingwen » Fri Sep 11, 2015 7:30 am

Rebrand yourselves MIB and get cool suits and shades.
People will be like.. kill me kill me... and you'll be like... no... 8-)
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Re: Black Caste declining in standards, debate!

Postby TreatRothschild » Fri Sep 11, 2015 9:35 am

Qingwen wrote:Rebrand yourselves MIB and get cool suits and shades.
People will be like.. kill me kill me... and you'll be like... no... 8-)

Everybody! Everybody! Look into this light here! *FLASH* You're dead. Thank you!
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Melchior Wardell
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Re: Black Caste declining in standards, debate!

Postby Melchior Wardell » Sat Sep 12, 2015 3:32 am

I would hate to be the one for killing a character that wants to remain alive. In fairness that is the choice of the victim. If anything the killing part is the less enjoyable part for me. It is the role play prior that i like most.

Thankfully I have been able to role play that part with people that understood why they were a mark. Most of them made the choice to play dead. For me that story ends with their or mine ending up dead. What they do afterwards is up to them. However there are sims that have rules about it.

When you play in a sim that demands perma death it is not my call but of those that moderate the role play. If you want to play there you and I have to stick by their rules. How silly we might find them.
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Anarch Allegiere
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Re: Black Caste declining in standards, debate!

Postby Anarch Allegiere » Sat Sep 12, 2015 4:08 am

I could be wrong about this, but I feel that over the past few years there has been slowly a shift towards more and more people preferring perma-death if they get killed through decent roleplay. Simply because the alternative isn't realistic or is hard to make sense from. After all people try to roleplay Gor 'realistically' as much as possible, and while they avoid having a history of having been part of a rainbow of different castes, they also will avoid having a background story that explains they died multiple times.

So it's a bit of a conflict between what Assassin RPers want: the victim respecting the kill, and what the victims want: the story to make sense, so they'll declare that the kill was in fact not a kill but a heavy wound instead. After all the alternative we sometimes see on more old-school sims isn't exactly attractive either: dudes explaining that the Priest-Kings brought them back alive, or that the Priest-Kings sewed their heads back on, or w/e.
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Re: Black Caste declining in standards, debate!

Postby Sin » Sat Sep 12, 2015 2:52 pm

I have never understood why an MA is needed to validate an assassins kill. Whether rp is valid or not, according to a sims rules is a decision for a moderator. There is no special requirement or qualification to moderate a BC's roleplay, over and above any other kind of roleplay. Moderators took care of validity issues on my sims regardless of whether BC rp was involved.

As in all rp, there are good BC's and dire ones, some who have done the "training"in rp and some who are still appalling rpers and crybabies despite having done that same "training". There are good MA's that are impartial and some who are absolutely not. Just the same as there are marks who will rp an assassination reasonably and some that will turn into utter douchebags and spend weeks trying to get their death invalidated.

I don't think that taking validation out of the hands of MA's would result in losing BC rp from SL gor however. It might make the caste less parochial and ensure that the players of BC's are judged on their rp (and perhaps combat ability) and not their friends/groups/photoshopped certificates.
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Re: Black Caste declining in standards, debate!

Postby Dren Bernard » Sat Sep 12, 2015 5:27 pm

Thank you all for you comments.

We have resolved the issue locally by requiring all BC kills to be pre-approved.
It was most encouraging to see a BC recently who had in his RP rules something about not accepting perma-death as he had spent too much time and money on his avi. That position statement goes for anyone with a proud long standing history in SL Gor. I know that may not be "gor realistic" but there are OOC considerations as well when a long history is build up over years, let alone all the Linden.

That is where some sims brought in the time limited - forget all - death, to offer a death to the killer and non-discontinuation of the storyline to the victim.

In response to this, it seems that some angry killers now slice the head from the body to make the IC repair job impossible or ludicrous. Winning at all cost seems to be their aim.

I think everyone has rights to decide what to do with their storyline as many on this forum are saying. However and like in the past, the level of sensibility and maturity here is higher than the average role player in SL Gor.
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Re: Black Caste declining in standards, debate!

Postby Harlequin » Sat Sep 12, 2015 10:32 pm

Sin wrote:Complete and total reasonable sense.


I'm finding myself baffled by the fact that this whole thing even exists. Shouldn't it be up to the sim and sim admins as to what's okay and what isn't? Do warriors have to have their kills approved by Master Warriors?
If Cadence drops a brick on someone do I need to find like, the one other Builder in SL Gor to have it approved? Like it or not, BC RPers are just RPers. There's nothing inherently special about them as people just due to being BC, and they shouldn't be forced to follow, or try to force on others, some strange set of behaviors that apparently leaves most people unsatisfied. This all seems like a serious overcomplication of something that is really up to the sim's players and admins. If the BC find that a place isn't good for their kind of RP, go elsewhere. If a sim finds a particular BC or group's methods shitty, ban them.

It seems so easy. And is how literally every other RP community in SL that I know of handles things. To be blunt. No group is ooc special because of what they play IC, and having a strange oversight committee doesn't change that. To ignorant old me the whole thing sounds a lot like the Green Mafia I heard so much about.
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Re: Black Caste declining in standards, debate!

Postby Sin » Sun Sep 13, 2015 1:33 pm

Dren Bernard wrote:
In response to this, it seems that some angry killers now slice the head from the body to make the IC repair job impossible or ludicrous. Winning at all cost seems to be their aim.


I know a few that do this, not because they must win at all costs, but because they have come up against players who simply refuse to die, to the point of having a green sew a severed head back on, whilst desperately trying to invalidate perfectly valid roleplay.

Whether a kill is valid or not, and how the victim chooses to handle it in their storyline are two different things. Most BC's I believe, are happy for the mark to do whatever-he-likes in terms of his storyline, as long as they are accorded a valid kill if it is deserved.

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