Amanda Knox, Innocent or Guilty?

Is Amanda Knox...

Guilty?
4
20%
Guilty?
4
20%
Innocent?
6
30%
Innocent?
6
30%
 
Total votes: 20
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Mynerva
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Re: Amanda Knox, Innocent or Guilty?

Postby Mynerva » Fri Feb 07, 2014 8:30 am

Glaucon wrote:
It is a fair argument (though, personally, I am of two minds about it). Opponents of the death penalty usually believe that a criminal justice system that uses the death penalty is barbaric.

Italy does not have the death penalty. The USA does.



Glaucon, you are obsessed with comparing everything to the U.S.

It is a pretty unhealthy obsession.

Even if someone has nothing to do with how things are done in the U.S. - even when a point is made that has nothing to do with the U.S. or how things are done there.....you bring it up.
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Re: Amanda Knox, Innocent or Guilty?

Postby Glaucon » Fri Feb 07, 2014 8:43 am

Leah was going into detail about how criminal justice works in the USA. Hence me still talking about the comparison. Not sure if that is really an obsession. :eh:
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Re: Amanda Knox, Innocent or Guilty?

Postby DarbyDollinger » Fri Feb 07, 2014 9:06 am

You have a tendency that a lot of Europeans have of lecturing Americans, which is a bit dull, Glaucon. For example, you sneer about American not knowing Silvio. How many Europeans know the name of the Chinese President or Japan's PM?
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Re: Amanda Knox, Innocent or Guilty?

Postby Anarch Allegiere » Fri Feb 07, 2014 9:32 am

Several replies in this thread seemed to give of the idea and belief that the US legal system was superiour and more fair. So I can see why Glaucon brought up the comparisons. People were trying to discredit the Italian legal system based on a few examples after all and Glaucon was only showing how the same could easily be done with the US.

And to be completely fair, the US legal (and political) system is very much considered a bad joke in the academic world. I'm not sure it would be fair or purposeful to deny this general opinion.

All said and done though from what I understand if the US was concerned with fairness they'd follow the extradition treaties they have and often depend on when they need it from Europe. Amanda Knox should be extradited back to Italy and trialed there by their legal system, which also keeps her innocent until proven guilt, will bring her before Courts d'Assise with juries etc. Although admittedly there was foul play in that too since the media was responsible for manipulating public opinion with false facts and sensationalism.

Either way, she should be extradited and trialed in Italy, if they'd ask for it.

I personally don't really gives a rat's ass though about who killed Kercher or not, and wether or not they'd get punished for it.
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Re: Amanda Knox, Innocent or Guilty?

Postby Mynerva » Fri Feb 07, 2014 10:47 am

Glaucon wrote: Not sure if that is really an obsession. :eh:



It is ;)
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Re: Amanda Knox, Innocent or Guilty?

Postby Leah » Fri Feb 07, 2014 10:51 am

Anarch Allegiere wrote:Either way, she should be extradited and trialed in Italy, if they'd ask for it.


She was already tried in Italy. Soo...it would be extradition to put her in jail.

That said, it's going to depend on how badly Italy wants her. She's probably going to claim Double Jeopardy.
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Re: Amanda Knox, Innocent or Guilty?

Postby TreatRothschild » Fri Feb 07, 2014 11:57 am

Glaucon wrote:
Caius wrote:I have no opinion about Amanda Knox. Is she guilty or not? I have no clue about that, I only know that court in Italy thinks she is.

But I know this: mankind is faulty and makes errors from time to time. So, of course, also the justice system of any country in the world is prone to errors.

So a judge in any country of the world should never be able to make decisions, which cannot be remedied later, like sentencing someone to death.


It is a fair argument (though, personally, I am of two minds about it). Opponents of the death penalty usually believe that a criminal justice system that uses the death penalty is barbaric.

Italy does not have the death penalty. The USA does.

Not everywhere. Some of the states do not have Capitol Punishment, some do. At the Federal level, we do but for a select few crimes. Like, Terrorism.

Now, that should open the flood gates for the Boston Bomber and allow Anarch to sneer at us some more. That's fine.
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Re: Amanda Knox, Innocent or Guilty?

Postby TreatRothschild » Fri Feb 07, 2014 11:59 am

Leah wrote:
Anarch Allegiere wrote:Either way, she should be extradited and trialed in Italy, if they'd ask for it.


She was already tried in Italy. Soo...it would be extradition to put her in jail.

That said, it's going to depend on how badly Italy wants her. She's probably going to claim Double Jeopardy.

I don't know if Double Jeopardy will fly given that Italy doesn't recognize the concept. I don't, personally, believe that she will go back to Italy. Like you said, Leah, it will depend on how badly Italy wants her.
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Re: Amanda Knox, Innocent or Guilty?

Postby Glaucon » Fri Feb 07, 2014 12:25 pm

@ Mynerva: What Anarch was kind enough to say in my defense on that point (thank you, Anarch).

DarbyDollinger wrote:You have a tendency that a lot of Europeans have of lecturing Americans, which is a bit dull, Glaucon.


Sure, a lot of Europeans do that. To be honest, I think I am rather nuanced about it compared to most Europeans. Like Anarch said, most consider the US justice system (and political system) to be bad jokes. They usually base their judgment on what they hear in the news, the worst excesses. Much like people in the USA do regarding Italy, apparently. I do try to be fairer than that. :)

For example, you sneer about American not knowing Silvio. How many Europeans know the name of the Chinese President or Japan's PM?


Very few. But the same is true for Americans. And how many of those know who Steven Harper is? Or Enrique Peña Nieto? I'd guess that most people in Europe would at least be able to name Hollande, Cameron, Merkel and Erdogan. And I think they'd know where Florida, Texas and California are on a map, as well. But Silvio is a bit of an exceptional character. His antics make him rather like Rob Ford, but a Rob Ford that has been at it for decades and one that has been dominating the politics of the 9th biggest economy for a very long time (until recently, but you never know with Silvio).

And hey... it was just an aside.

I agree that the USA is probably not going to extradite Knox. Public opinion is clearly on her side and most officials won't like going against that.
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Re: Amanda Knox, Innocent or Guilty?

Postby Leah » Fri Feb 07, 2014 5:03 pm

TreatRothschild wrote:I don't know if Double Jeopardy will fly given that Italy doesn't recognize the concept. I don't, personally, believe that she will go back to Italy. Like you said, Leah, it will depend on how badly Italy wants her.


It depends on whether she can convince a judge that it should protect her as a US Citizen.

It also heavily depends on whether she can get politicians involved (which is actually pretty possible, especially in an election year).
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