Slaves and Gor RP sims

Discussions related to Kajira, Kajirus, Bonds and Thralls.
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Leah
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Re: Slaves and Gor RP sims

Postby Leah » Sun Dec 07, 2014 5:43 pm

BlueConover wrote:Sorry to buck the trend here and not jump on the "OMG THIS IS BULLSHIT AND SO UNFAIR!" Wagon.

The other side of the coin was all the ooc abuse and bullshit drama that gets flashed in ims and groups because of how bored a slave girl is.

People asked for notecards of rp from slave chores, so they knew that if they entered the tavern that the larma pies had been cooked and we could start eating them in the future,

that the desk had been cleaned but they missed the blood splatters in the corner so we can rp the itneraction of FAILING to actually do the chores.

These kinda rules didnt just spring out of now where they sprung from constant and regularly complaints and arguements about not having rp. not getting treated in a certain manner when they met their master.

Hell, I know one slave character that was aghast at how I did things because I didnt do them how she had been told she should be treated.

Ive had slaves bitch and moan about how Im abusing them because I dont whip and beat them half to death for an infraction but send them on a boring but informative trek for me.

Sometimes things evolve because its easier and less drama filled to do these things.
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If people can't figure out how to RP that the tavern has or has not been cleaned without requiring some RPer to exile herself from other people and manually RP out cleaning them, then I really don't know what to say to that. I mean, that's just dumb.

If I'm bored, I don't want to be given an NC chore. That isn't going to make me less bored. If I'm bored, what I want is for someone to RP with me. Like, a real live human that isn't a chore that I have to write down on some stupid notecard. If your slaves are complaining about being bored, chances are they either can't get anyone to RP with them or there's no one TO RP with them. In which case you need to do some work, dude.

Harlequin wrote:Just going to say that I've never seen a sim that had similar requirements. When we accepted shipments of cargo from Midian, I didn't have my people RP out every single small thing... because it's tedious. We'd do the fun stuff, and then either throw in things we missed for fun, or let others put something out there for us to roll with.

When you buy a slave goad from Cadence I absolutely do not stand alone in my workshop posting for 3 hours about building it. Why should a slave have to?

This all has me thinking though... I'm trying to start up the higher class tavern in Turia, and will need need NEED slaves to staff it, serve it, dance in it, get abused in it.

What can I do/offer to give RP, good RP, to those players, instead of just taking them for granted? Because I've noticed in most taverns the slaves "Serving" in it are either really poor, or are just going through the motions because they're treated, as we've said, like they're not real RPers.

I'm open to suggestions and ideas, because I want to make it a spurring point for RP for -everyone-. Except free women. The hussies.


I would love to see slaves out in the streets, trying to entice men into the tavern. You could also try holding events at the tavern to get people to show up. If there are people in your tavern, you'll often have slaves in the tavern, too!
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Sasi
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Re: Slaves and Gor RP sims

Postby Sasi » Sun Dec 07, 2014 8:34 pm

That Liara said...

Notecarded chores are so old school Gor crap. If I had to RP a slave, I wouldn't want to be forced to RP the mundane, it's as much exciting as cleaning my cat litter box in RL, sorry.

If I RP a slave, I want the interactions with people, the emotions, the suspense, the unexpected. I want to be able to plot to improve my character's position in the chain, to get bought by a wealthy owner, I want to RP the conflicts, jealousy, rivalry with other slaves.

I don't log in SL to describe how I make the dishes or scrub a floor. They are chores I do in RL. I am not interested in serving your RP in being the element of decoration in your scene background, the one who brings the drinks and once done, is ignored until another guy needs his paga or a free wench her tea.

And if you want to know if a chore has been done (if my character is a low slave, domestic one, etc, not all slaves have chores to perform in books), come RP with my character to check it, in a role play scene. The details that your character will have to notice will be emoted by me. You won't have any NC to read, because anyway, the chore itself will have been FTB. My character may have chores to perform daily, it's part of her background. Doesn't mean that I, the typist, will describe one and past it on a notecard. We are almost in 2015, not in 2007/2008, time for mentalities to definitely change.
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Re: Slaves and Gor RP sims

Postby Pepper » Sun Dec 07, 2014 10:23 pm

Bored slaves is very 2007. Seriously, that was a problem that we (those of us that play/played slaves) had back then. There shouldn't be a single bored slave rper anymore. A few years ago, what was widely expected of us was that we were good, obedient, mindless, and perfect. Seen and not heard, until spoken to. 12 step serves with perfectly worded precise posts, never say "Tal" (because that was for Free only), but always interrupt conversation to greet every Free in order of importance and greet every slave with a respectful "Greetings Sissy!". If we wanted to rp something outside of that, we were scolded (usually oocly) for it. So because we were bored, it became someone's great idea to give us chores to do. But when slave rp'ers started just going afk and coming back 20 mins later to say they cleaned everything to precision, suddenly the NC of the rp was required. The IC/OOC line was very blurred - all because it was everyone else's responsibility to give us something to rp besides being silently listening to all the Free rp around us.

But we've come a long way since then. SL Gor in general is very accepting of slaves having their own personalities, dialogues, parts in a rp scene, and their own rp stories. There is no reason that the NC Chore system should still be active, unless you're on a sim still stuck in the heyday of cookie cutter Stepford slaves that don't speak until it's time to greet or do their long 12 step serve. If you have a slave complaining that she's bored, give her a bina bead and tell her to go create a slave gambling ring for bina beads. Anything other than NC'd chores.
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Re: Slaves and Gor RP sims

Postby BlueConover » Mon Dec 08, 2014 4:01 pm

Sasi wrote:
And if you want to know if a chore has been done (if my character is a low slave, domestic one, etc, not all slaves have chores to perform in books), come RP with my character to check it, in a role play scene. The details that your character will have to notice will be emoted by me. You won't have any NC to read, because anyway, the chore itself will have been FTB. My character may have chores to perform daily, it's part of her background. Doesn't mean that I, the typist, will describe one and past it on a notecard. We are almost in 2015, not in 2007/2008, time for mentalities to definitely change.


I'm sorry that I have such mundane needs and responsibilites like.. Work, and Sleep. and that I cant actually interact with every person 24/7

I can see it now.
-gives slave some chores to complete-

Me: Did you complete them?
Slave: Yes Master
me: great.

as apposed to

Me: did you complete your chores -glances through the notecards checking the details-
Slave: yes master!
Me: you lied look you missed the dust bunnies in the corner!!

All i see is people bitching that its out of order its old school tis boring it's so unfair.
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Re: Slaves and Gor RP sims

Postby Harlequin » Mon Dec 08, 2014 4:52 pm

Holy cats, you're so wrong... you're not even wrong. You have leagues to go before you can even just be simply wrong, because your base is so wildly different from what RP is that everything in your post is fundementally flawed.

"I'm sorry that I have such mundane needs and responsibilites like.. Work, and Sleep. and that I cant actually interact with every person 24/7"

Newsflash. You don't have to be because unless you're one of those tools that finds a player playing a slave character willing to put up with crap like 'Don't RP without me ever and don't leave the house (or whatever) unless I say you can" there's a whole world of RP out there. It's almost like people shouldn't be dependent only on you.

Oh, sorry, in the books thats the way it was... sort of. It's also achingly dull, so thank god few people do it now.

Now, if Cadence tells Tamar "Do this thing" like, the night before, do I expect that she's going to spend an hour crafting solo posts while I'm at work to make sure I can pick through it? Hells no, unless she found it kinda fun. But I'm not coming home and being annoyed she doesn't have a notecard of posts for me to nitpick through for "roleplay" because holy mother of god that sounds boring.

Instead I'll pick something. Or ask her if she thinks her character would have done a thing, because if you're looking for RP a good RP partner is going to give you that hook, and you don't need to stand around and type into a notecard just to create that hook.

Now, I'm not saying that RPing chores is bad, sometimes for people it can be fun. I did write up how we recieved supplies for example, but I'm not about to tell others they have to RP it too, and then notecard it for "proof". That's insipid. Moreover, I wager you don't think that Free RPers need to RP out every detail of their workday, do you? I mean after all. You have work, sleep, and therefore can't chronicle your every day. Does that mean if I fight you IC, and you can't show me logs of your training with a sword, I can just kill you because you obviously didn't do it?

This has little, imo, to do with "Old School" other than the fact that in early Gor bad RP, and ooc/ic blurring bullshit was a hallmark of the genre. Attitudes like this are why Gor sims struggle to find new blood from outside of the Gorean RPers because people ran into attitudes like this and straight up refuse to engage in it again because they just don't want to put up with the micromanaging bullshit.

There are times and ways to notecard, like if you're trying to say you've got a security system, or how your character has built a new type of slave goad, or something. I'm not saying every personal RP is just ephemeral... but to force it, to expect it, and to expect that if you don't make people literally do work, a chore, for you that they'll just go "Oh I did everything perfect"... holy heck, what kind of people did you RP with?
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Re: Slaves and Gor RP sims

Postby Tamar Luminos » Mon Dec 08, 2014 5:46 pm

Hee, Blue- your post is so lifestyler and throwback it actually made me smile with nostalgia. That said, most of us here are roleplayers now, I believe, not lifestylers and try to be careful to keep "the player/typist" and "the character" separate.

I play a slave character in Gor, Harlequin's free man's character's slave to be exact, but I not only do not expect him to drive my roleplay, I don't let him dictate my roleplay OOC. How's that for a shocker? A slave who dares not let her Master dictate her actions??? But the thing is- I play a slave character in SL, that doesn't mean I AM a slave OOC, and that means that I don't allow or appreciate anyone trying to get all up in my grill telling me how to play my character or how to spend my limited free time (same as you, go figure!) when I'm logged in to Second Life, roleplaying in a sim.

I think you're looking for lifestyle Goreans, and that's cool and all, just please be aware that there aren't very many of you left around here that I've seen, and that means that most of what we say you aren't going to agree with and vice versa due to a fundamental difference of opinion. You seem to think people playing slaves should be treated like slaves and "kept busy" and made to NC things you told them to do in order to give you some sort of roleplay ideas to work off of.

These days, most people who roleplay together are able to connect OOC via IM's to keep tabs on the roleplay and set up scenes and brainstorm ideas together, as equal players working together to set up scenes and storylines. Here's how your exchange would go with roleplayers (not lifestylers):

-IM's roleplay partner-

Harlequin: Hey, I had an idea. What if Cadence barked at Tamar to clean house and she missed a dust bunny in the corner and then he'd get to punish her? *evil laugh*

Tamar: Ooh, that's cool and all but I got a better idea! What if Cadence caught Tamar making out with another slavegirl, with a pouch full of stolen coins? *even more evil laugh*

Harlequin: ...let's go with your idea.

And la, ideas are exchanged, scenes are set up, roleplay hooks created without trying to "SL dom" your roleplay partner.

The vast majority of us on this board, I believe are roleplayers, and that's why you will find us rejecting the old ideas in Gor sims that claim to be roleplay sims but are really just clinging to lifestyler throwback habits. But don't worry! There are still plenty of lifestyle Gor sims out there that you should feel comfortable playing in, take a look at their rules and see if they require slaves to do NC's, chores, and give tours and there ya go! Just, be aware that there are now plenty of people who are determined to avoid those sorts of sims and are looking for roleplay sims instead and those types of sims do not treat one type of player differently just because of the type of character they play (such as require only slave characters to do NC, chores, tours, etc.), and are able to clearly separate characters from typists.

And that's also why your post, which appears to be trying to make people feel ashamed for "bitching" about you (and presumably other..uh..."masters"? "freemen"?) not being willing or able to supervise our roleplay (presumably "slaves"?) 24/7 and championing the NC as a way for us to feed you roleplay is going to strike, well- pretty much all of us as ridiculous. Because to me, and other roleplayers, you're a player. Not a master, not a free man. But a character, just like I am. I am not a slave, an android, an elf, or a demon, despite those being characters I have played in Second Life. We are not what we play in the video game interface known as Second Life. And thusly, we play the game as equals, regardless of what type of character we play, and are not responsible for or allowed to dictate each others' roleplay without a consent arrangement set up in that regard. And if I don't wish to use NC as a way of feeding people roleplay, I won't. I don't want or need them to "keep busy", instead I'll get my happy av ass out and scare up some roleplay on my own, or hit someone up in IM's to set up a scene if I'm running low on time. Another way to scare up roleplay is to post a "looking for..." post on a forum, with an idea or situation, to see if any like-minded, interested people want to jump in with you.

So, if you're a lifestyler, find a lifestyle sim. If you're a roleplayer, find a roleplay sim. 's pretty simple, really. But I don't feel the least bit ashamed for knowing what I want and like and how to get it. Best of luck figuring out the same!
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Re: Slaves and Gor RP sims

Postby Harlequin » Mon Dec 08, 2014 5:48 pm

In other news, if there's a slave who wants to get caught nicking coinpurses with Tamar, I'm good and open to suggestions.
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Sasi
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Re: Slaves and Gor RP sims

Postby Sasi » Mon Dec 08, 2014 9:13 pm

BlueConover wrote:
Sasi wrote:
And if you want to know if a chore has been done (if my character is a low slave, domestic one, etc, not all slaves have chores to perform in books), come RP with my character to check it, in a role play scene. The details that your character will have to notice will be emoted by me. You won't have any NC to read, because anyway, the chore itself will have been FTB. My character may have chores to perform daily, it's part of her background. Doesn't mean that I, the typist, will describe one and past it on a notecard. We are almost in 2015, not in 2007/2008, time for mentalities to definitely change.


I'm sorry that I have such mundane needs and responsibilites like.. Work, and Sleep. and that I cant actually interact with every person 24/7

I can see it now.
-gives slave some chores to complete-

Me: Did you complete them?
Slave: Yes Master
me: great.

as apposed to

Me: did you complete your chores -glances through the notecards checking the details-
Slave: yes master!
Me: you lied look you missed the dust bunnies in the corner!!

All i see is people bitching that its out of order its old school tis boring it's so unfair.
Look up Kevin by Harry Enfield. Most of you sound like this character.



You are totally wrong. You don't need a NC (and don't even need the chore to be effectively RPed) after your character told his slave to perform a chore, like cleaning a room for example. So, imagine, I play your character's girl. Here starts our scene when you're back:

Me: /me didn't feel very comfortable when Blue stepped into the room for the purpose to check if she had properly cleaned it. She gulped, bit her bottom lip, dropped to her knees and she nervously taped her fingertips on her thighs, hoping that he wouldn't notice the little hump which deformed a bit a corner of the rug, exactly where she had pushed, while sweeping, a bunny dust that she had been too lazy to pick up and throw outside the house. Hiding it under the rug had sounded like a smart idea at that moment but she was not so sure it had been very clever, now.... Her heart racing, she took a deep breath and pitched a poor smile at the man, trying her best to look innocent....

Now, up to your character to notice that mine gave some hints of discomfort, to notice or not the bunny dust under the rug. That is a RP scene. If you cannot commit to such scene, don't give chores to a slave. Personally, I am an adult, I am perfectly able to find my RP by myself if I want when the guy playing my character's owner is offline. If I don't find anyone to play with me, I will go to shop or play gachas or anything I want. Filling notecards of mundane chores is not my conception of fun RP.

Don't insult your fellow players' intelligence and creativity in requiring they fill NC to have something to do and RP. We are not kids.
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Tamar Luminos
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Re: Slaves and Gor RP sims

Postby Tamar Luminos » Mon Dec 08, 2014 9:43 pm

You are totally wrong. You don't need a NC (and don't even need the chore to be effectively RPed) after your character told his slave to perform a chore, like cleaning a room for example. So, imagine, I play your character's girl. Here starts our scene when you're back:

Me: /me didn't feel very comfortable when Blue stepped into the room for the purpose to check if she had properly cleaned it. She gulped, bit her bottom lip, dropped to her knees and she nervously taped her fingertips on her thighs, hoping that he wouldn't notice the little hump which deformed a bit a corner of the rug, exactly where she had pushed, while sweeping, a bunny dust that she had been too lazy to pick up and throw outside the house. Hiding it under the rug had sounded like a smart idea at that moment but she was not so sure it had been very clever, now.... Her heart racing, she took a deep breath and pitched a poor smile at the man, trying her best to look innocent....

Now, up to your character to notice that mine gave some hints of discomfort, to notice or not the bunny dust under the rug. That is a RP scene. If you cannot commit to such scene, don't give chores to a slave. Personally, I am an adult, I am perfectly able to find my RP by myself if I want when the guy playing my character's owner is offline. If I don't find anyone to play with me, I will go to shop or play gachas or anything I want. Filling notecards of mundane chores is not my conception of fun RP.

Don't insult your fellow players' intelligence and creativity in requiring they fill NC to have something to do and RP. We are not kids.


Woot! Can't applaud this enough. Beautifully put. :thumbup:
"...to take truth for granted is not to know it. Truth not won is not possessed. We are not entitled to truths for which we have not fought." --- (Marauders of Gor, p.7)
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Pepper
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Re: Slaves and Gor RP sims

Postby Pepper » Mon Dec 08, 2014 9:57 pm

BlueConover wrote:as apposed to


*opposed.

What they all said in respect to your post, I echo. I'm glad they saved me the keystrokes and posted some really good common sense. And if Sasi's emote was too long for you (I'm getting the one liner vibe, which is cool if it's your thing), try this one.

Master: Did you do your chores?
Slave: /me hopes he doesn't see the dust bunny in the corner. "Yes Master!"
Master: Then what's that? *points to dust bunny*

Voila. You just saved her all that time writing a NC, and you all that time wasted reading it just to find out what you could have been told in one short line of RP.

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