Appearance Modification: Who pays?

Discussions related to Kajira, Kajirus, Bonds and Thralls.

Who pays for the avatar modifications?

The slaver
21
21%
The slaver
21
21%
The slave
10
10%
The slave
10
10%
Both
13
13%
Both
13
13%
Other
5
5%
Other
5
5%
 
Total votes: 98
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Double Aa
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Re: Appearance Modification: Who pays?

Postby Double Aa » Mon Apr 25, 2011 7:47 pm

I'm not going to answer the questions that requested more information because I'm not really sure what additional information would be useful. I think the OP pretty much speaks for itself.

Personally, I voted for slave for much of the same reasons Dove did. I consider the physical representation of the avatar to be an OOC thing, separate from the roleplay. So whether the slave player wants to make her avatar match the roleplay is entirely up to her.

Thanks everyone for the comments.
"In Gor, everyone plays to win so we just set up the rules to create mutually assured destruction."
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Echo
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Re: Appearance Modification: Who pays?

Postby Echo » Tue Apr 26, 2011 8:18 am

FeorieFrimon wrote:My avatar, I pay for it. Thats what I think, at least, so long as we're not talking about brand specifics.

I mean, 'I want you to have dark skin' isn't the same thing as 'I want you to buy this specific skin..oh, and by the way, it's $5,000L.'.


Yes this.
You want a Dina or a kef? cool I have those and know where to get them if need be. You want me to wear the custom brand of house holierthanthepks then the other guy supplies that.
Had my hair cut by someone. I ran out and bought appropriate hair. My AV my cost.
Ran a tavern and had matching camisks for the girls. I went out and bought those and handed them out.

And as Lady Dove has said. Purchasing is the OOC question. The feeding, branding, and grooming of the slave is IC.
"In order to roleplay in SL Gor, you first need to accept that people are not sensible." by Chron
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Thyri
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Re: Appearance Modification: Who pays?

Postby Thyri » Tue Apr 26, 2011 8:34 am

There is however then the question of how much of a visual environment are we in.

If I came to a sim dressed as elvis, but I RPed as being dressed in Gor appropriate apparel, would that still be acceptable? Or would a change be required in order to conform to the visual RP environment?

Just saying is all. If we say that how we RP supercedes any IC changes, and our avatar appearance is now OOC, I think that paves a way for a pretty slippery slope.
Be very polite. -Flagg RIP 2009
JackoS
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Re: Appearance Modification: Who pays?

Postby JackoS » Tue Apr 26, 2011 8:47 am

Thyri wrote:There is however then the question of how much of a visual environment are we in.

If I came to a sim dressed as elvis, but I RPed as being dressed in Gor appropriate apparel, would that still be acceptable? Or would a change be required in order to conform to the visual RP environment?

Just saying is all. If we say that how we RP supercedes any IC changes, and our avatar appearance is now OOC, I think that paves a way for a pretty slippery slope.

Thyri, couldn't agree more. If all that matters is the roleplay and the visuals, animations, etc didn't matter, lets all go back to IRC and HTML... There who cares about the views? it is a blank screen.

As to the question, if the slaver wants, he should pay or let the slave go free, or sell her to somebody less demanding. However never forget how is it that the girl came into the possession of the slaver. If she was sold to him in RP, he had a good view of her before buying her, so he knew what he was getting. If she was taken as captive in a raid etc from another city, then well, bad luck, just as gorean in the books are stucked with what the get, the same happens here. Tell your raiders, suppliers then to start focusing on the quality rather than quantity.

If it is the slave that shows up and begs to be admitted into the man's house, then sure, the man has every right to tell her that if she wants his collar she should get whatever he requires for her to meet his standards.
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Re: Appearance Modification: Who pays?

Postby Kaitlin » Tue Apr 26, 2011 8:51 am

Thyri wrote:
There is however then the question of how much of a visual environment are we in.

If I came to a sim dressed as elvis, but I RPed a
s being dressed in Gor appropriate apparel, would that still be acceptable? Or would a change be required in order to conform to the visual RP environment?

Just saying is all. If we say that how we RP supercedes any IC changes, and our avatar appearance is now OOC, I think that paves a way for a pretty slippery slope.


Most sims have very specific rules on gorean dress and may even offer free versions of an outfit so I don't see this being a huge issue. We RP daily things that are not visual...if I emote tapping my foot or rolling my eyes I depend on others to accept my words at face value. Common sense goes a long way in knowing where to draw the line and understand a visual may be needed. If I'm a blonde who is emoting about my long flowing red tresses or that I am bald as a goose then there is a problem but It doesn't mean I need truth hair over freebie hair for it to be authentic.

For me...my avatar and my inventory I pay. Another reason for this as well is that I am picky about what I like...I might be willing to spend twice as much as you would have spent on the same item. Some men have horrible taste and have no idea that nice silks cost 500 - 800L. If you offer to assist I'll say thanks but I won't ask if I sign on for the RP. If I feel the cost is more than I am comfortable with then I will let you know in IM since this is an OOC discussion and come up with an alternative or withdraw from the RP.
Some people create their own storms, then get upset when it rains.

Once upon a time... Kait
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Re: Appearance Modification: Who pays?

Postby Echo » Tue Apr 26, 2011 8:55 am

@Thyri
I was referring to who pays for changes to an appearance since this is done with ooc searching for free items or lindens. A sim requirement to dress in a gorean fashion basically means to try and fit the general theme of the setting.
I have been known to wear a Xena outfit as a panther. I have not been chastized for it because it is leathers. (Though it usually is cut off and burned in RP. :? ) As for dressing as Elvis? Large hair, female frame, white outfit decorated with gold and silver trim. . . As long as it had a skirt more than a few people would assume merchant caste. It is all how you accessorize. Now a uniform out of Star Trek. . I don't think I could spin into being gorean. ;)
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Thyri
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Re: Appearance Modification: Who pays?

Postby Thyri » Tue Apr 26, 2011 9:23 am

Obviously Elvis was an extreme example in this case. (that and i've seen Elvis cross into my sim's docks. He's alive and living on gor damnit!)

But if someone cuts someone's hair who is say... a new avatar. I would at least direct them to some NICE freebie short hair (if ETD still exists, they had some awesome short hair styles on the free) if they didnt want to spend a linden on their avatar's change.

But if someone RPs forcing my avatar to get a suntan (good luck, she burns very easily), bleaching her hair, giving her breast implants... honestly, I'd rather just stop the RP and get out of dodge. That kind of drastic change just isnt in me. I LIKE thyri being short, skinny, flat chested, and pale. Such a dramatic avatar change, honestly, I think I'd just reroll so to speak. Whip out an alt that fits their bill better than thyri can. I have pretty much all types except a very dark skinned girl. I have a redhead, I have a blonde, I have tall, I have short.. one of them might fit the bill better than going through such dramatic changes.

When I think of such dramatic changes I'm thinking that the RPer of the slaver wants to continue the RP with the slave RPer. At that point, the body of the avatar doesnt matter. The writer still is the writer.
Be very polite. -Flagg RIP 2009
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Curio
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Re: Appearance Modification: Who pays?

Postby Curio » Tue Apr 26, 2011 10:15 am

Erik wrote:I'm seeing a lot of "half-half" in here... Frankly I disagree.

If I, as the slaver or new owner want changes that cost money (hair, skin, clothing, etc.) - then *I* should be the one paying for it. Why? Because it is unlikely she will refuse me my wants. And therefor it would be *wrong* of me to make those changes, and (technically) force her to pay for them.

If she DOES refuse, then my answer is simply: good for her!

Now, if SHE wants to make changes (same things, hair, skin, clothing, whatever), then it is her own responsibility, unless I am feeling philanthropic and throw some money at her.

The *problem* (yes, I specifically choose to use that word: problem) is that she will NOT want to disappoint him. Therefore, if he says "buy this" or "buy that" she will - even to the point of spending real money to get the L$ needed. I've seen it way too many times.

My girl has a lot of L$. I have no idea how much, but I know she does, or at least has access to it just based on discussions and things said on the side. But yet, I still absolutely *insist* that I pay for anything and everything I want of her with regard to what she wears and any avatar enhancements (right down to hair style and the rest.) Why? Because it's something *I* want, and it not right to have her pay HER money for something *I* want.

That's how I see it.


-coughs-
My appearance. that of my avi is my problem. Though Erik might tell me what he likes and might want particular things of this girl, I might have a different opinion about her, or how she would wear something. We talk about it and I give my side, he gives his. Somewhere we have a meeting of the minds.

True, Lindens are not a problem for me. But actually, I spend very little. With 25L Tuesday and 30L Saturday...you really do not have to! Erik was very clear, expecially in the beginning, about how he wants his girl to appear. He bought several things and so now I know what he likes. When I see something that fits his style and it is a good price, I pick it up! But that is my choice.

Really, I see this all as a give and take between reasonable people. As the slaver/owner...Erik gets the last word about what Curio wears out of the house. I have no problem with that. Frankly,I am glad he notices.
Now if I could only get my hands on his sliders. :egrin:
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DorianM
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Re: Appearance Modification: Who pays?

Postby DorianM » Sun May 01, 2011 2:18 pm

I agree that if the slaver / owner wants a slave to have a particular appearance then it should absolutely be RP'ed out completely, and things like hair growth should not be instant for example, but rather happen gradually over a period of time. Further, I say the slaver demanding said changes should pay for them, provided that the slave's appearance was already gorean in nature. I refuse to pay to "fix" a girl who shows up with purple hair, demon eyes and black, tattooed lips, I also refuse to RP with such people and will ask them to leave OOCly, or simply kick them if they don't want to comply with the BTB nature of our slaver house.
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Re: Appearance Modification: Who pays?

Postby Pelopidas » Mon May 02, 2011 11:41 pm

Victor. wrote:Haven't read the other replies but mine is short so it can be squeezed in I guess:

If you want changes made to another avatar - you pay for it. Full stop


I agree with this.

Well, perhaps it's cultural or im just too old school, but where i come from you cant ask someone for something that would cost them money and not offer to pay for it. It's not about if they have the choice to decline or no, simply not offering to cover the cost is seen as discourteous. Also, your offer is supposed to be phony, meaning that it's not a real offer, if they decline and decide to cover the cost for them selves, you are supposed to insist till hell freezes or something. Especially if she is a girl, you pay, full stop and if she insists of sharing the cost or something, it can be seen as insulting, like refusing a gift. But i guess the issue is highly subjective.

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