On slave role play...

Discussions related to Kajira, Kajirus, Bonds and Thralls.
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Sasi
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On slave role play...

Postby Sasi » Mon Jan 25, 2016 12:37 am

I RP in SL Gor since 9 years, now, mostly a FW (18 months as a panther girl, 3 months as slave in 2007, some attempts again in this role in 2013 and 2014, never lasted more than one week...)

But 3 weeks ago, with an old friend of mine back in SL Gor in the role of my char's owner, I decided to invest more in such role. This friend owns my character, he is a wealthy man belonging to an affluent Arian family, my character is more a high slave, as well as one used to display her owner's status and wealth. He is rather permissive with her, you could say she is some pampered princess.

As I know very well the Gorean culture, I think my RP is coherent with the character I chose. My slave is enslaved since one year and not much happy in slavery, she is conniving, smart, easily haughty and feels herself above other slaves. Men have set slave fires in her belly (following the books' expression....) and she is the kind who will kneel when addressed by a free person, and may even put her head down to the ground in presence of a FW, as the books make clear that FW who already, very commonly hate slave girls by inward envy and jealousy, might even been harsher to a high slave.

When I played a FW, I often got compliments in IMs from the people with whom I played for my creativity and they enjoyed the storylines we wrote together. I had no difficulties to get RP, and I must confess, with men, the difficulty was more to not yield to the temptation of getting laid and have fun in sex RP, to stay coherent with the rank, the status and the personality of my FW characters.

So, call me naive, but I was certain, in making this slave character, that I would have a lot of fun in RP, in a new challenging role.

I was wrong and I guess that I can confirm what many slave RPers denounce.

So, what I gathered, from my stil short experience:

- Slave characters are mostly ignored by FW, and when not, most will make you wonder what did they miss when they read the Gor novels, when each book states that FW hate slave girls and are cruel to them...

- You might get some nice through emote if you dare to emote about slave character's needs, craving for the touch of a man, if she tries to entice men. You will be so reminded that Gor is not just about sex blah blah. It happened recently to a friend of mine (guess many people missed the primary purpose of a slave and their deep misery when they are deprived of sex, as told in the books).

- That unlike the stories in the books, SL Gorean males are loyal to their FC and never aroused by a slave girl. Anyway, they prefer to spend their time with FW....

- You will probably discover that some people think they do you a favor if they interrupt the RP you are having with another slave, to send you to play a waitress in the local inn, because there is no serving slave at this moment to serve. Not once they will consider that it makes absolutely no sense to send a private slave, not owned by such establishment, and the slave of a wealthy man, serve in the local tavern / inn with such reason. And actually, I prefer no RP instead to RP this kind of crap.
Really, it doesn't seem difficult to me, to drag a random slave with you to the next innn / tavern, to keep her at your table and entertaining yourself with her charms, her conversation, while both typists emote about NPC serving / paga girls (and too, there is no inn/tavern in books, with no slave to serve the customers....) But for some people, nah, unthinkable....

- That unlike they need a drink and a city tour, many people don't know what kind of interactions they could have with a slave character.

- Many people expect, when they see a private slave, that she will come kneel at their feet and beg to serve. Give me one reason for which a slave privatively owned would do that? I have yet to see such scene in the books. But in books, a slave, who has been deprived of sex, may go beg a random man. Personally, I'm not bold enough to start such RP and be told that Gor is not about cybersex....

- FW get more erotic RP than slave girls (which I suspected when I played a FW, tough....)

- You will certainly be asked again that non sense of slave registration (well, your RP partner, the one who plays your character's owner). Certainly, some people believe it's fun to fill a NC called "slave papers", which will bring no RP at all anyway, especially when you's suggested to drop the note in a mailbox.... (not to mention the slave exam....). I wonder if the scribes meet after, with all these papers and start RPing how they read and file them by alphabetical order in their cabinets.....

- That your funniest RPs will happen with other slave rpers (but I knew this already, when I played a FW)

- That these same people who often RP with Earth morals, like white knights, who change their character's home stone every 3 months, FW who behave in a way where in the books they would be frowned upon, etc etc, still, will require that slaves RP by the books, with no compromise.....

- That people will easily send you away from a scene with pretexts such as "we're dealing caste business"... Examples:
► Show Spoiler

Seriously, when playing a FW, I never felt the need to send a slave away from a scene when one had joined it, never. If my character feared a spy, it was simple, my char threatened the girl to cut her tongue off, then I included her in the scene, OOCly enjoying the possible IC troubles which could follow, if some little secrets, even those of my char, were reported! But there, be sure that these people will speak of realism, when themselves should seriously, sometimes, study their role and re-write their non sense character.....



I must add something important: From my chats with other slave players, these situations are not specific to some particular sims. It's everywhere... But some sims are owned by people who, at least, won't make you feel like a second class SL Resident, nor, write OOC rules which are full of OOC discriminations and restrictions toward slave players.
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Tamar Luminos
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Re: On slave role play...

Postby Tamar Luminos » Mon Jan 25, 2016 11:36 am

Yeah...sadly, I can corroborate pretty much all of that. :(

Getting ignored and post-jumped and completely left out of scenes, even ones you try really hard to post into and interact in, is pretty hard. I think all that is why most of the really good roleplayers I know don't bother playing slave characters anymore, don't bother trying to play in a Gor setting anymore, really. Sucks for those of us who still really love the setting and would like to be able to play in it and have fun.
"...to take truth for granted is not to know it. Truth not won is not possessed. We are not entitled to truths for which we have not fought." --- (Marauders of Gor, p.7)
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Tantus
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Re: On slave role play...

Postby Tantus » Mon Jan 25, 2016 4:06 pm

People possibly do generalise slaves as a waste of bandwidth.

I've been in many group situations where the free-characters are posting short emotes. Then a slave wanders in and begins with paragraphs of passive fluff. So I'll skip through the lines looking for anything relevant, then read the next post as normal. This goes back many years, when I had a comedy sketch in mind of how free men perceive slave roleplay.

► Show Spoiler


That poor girl is beating out the best damned serve she's ever written but no one's going to read it. She's excited to hit two paragraphs of finding and cleaning a goblet with no dents or chips - fuck yeah! For everyone else it's two paragraphs too long for something they've read a dozen times already. What men look for is, her avatar returning to his side and he'll post an anti-climatic "good girl.. takes his drink" - Before - she's dropped her triple paragraph finale of raising the goblet in offer.

Sometimes you'll see it happen because few people are bothering to read slave-roleplay at all. Now you can jump up and say, "Hold on! Not all slaves roleplay repetitive serves directly from her NC! Many have original content and attitude!"

I'm not claiming there aren't. But when you take BTB Gor as a whole and consider every slave in every city, the majority fill a generic role. They're the sort you'll encounter most often. And the odd slave who's roleplaying her character, is the type there might be one of them online at any given time.

But for those who can roleplay well, I've sometimes seen profile conditions like "won't roleplay sex unless it's part of a story". Which is like saying, 'if you want it, you've got to put a ring on it.'

I personally don't roleplay with 'owned slaves' either. A lot of people claim their relationship is IC only, but it's rarely like that. And if you've invested some RP in an owned slave, then her owner logs in... you'll get an IM saying she needs to TP home. And that's an hour or two of RP wasted.

I may be out of touch with it all, the last I recall roleplaying with a slave at length was back in Kaelus. About 2 years ago?
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Tamar Luminos
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Re: On slave role play...

Postby Tamar Luminos » Mon Jan 25, 2016 7:44 pm

But for those who can roleplay well, I've sometimes seen profile conditions like "won't roleplay sex unless it's part of a story". Which is like saying, 'if you want it, you've got to put a ring on it.'

I personally don't roleplay with 'owned slaves' either. A lot of people claim their relationship is IC only, but it's rarely like that. And if you've invested some RP in an owned slave, then her owner logs in... you'll get an IM saying she needs to TP home. And that's an hour or two of RP wasted.


I take the "won't roleplay sex unless it's part of a story" to mean more "please don't just treat me like a blow up doll, but actually roleplay with me", which is a valid point...and one I'm torn on. On the one hand, if some random guy character were to walk up to my slave character, snag her, shove her up against a wall for a quickie, then push a coin in her mouth and walk on- wow. That'd be one hell of a scene and I'd freakin' love it. But- if that was ALL the IC interaction I ever got, I'd get bored with it and want some variety. After a while. So if I had months of just random quickie roleplay, I might be inclined to put something like that in my profile too, but more like, "I adore sexytime roleplay stuff, but can, and want to do so much more too, so like, please toss some meatier roleplay my way once in awhile, kthx?" Buuuuut, that's just me.

And when I've played a slave, I've usually played an 'owned slave' (with the owner being my OOC main squeeze, as well) but he and I both enjoy playing with other people (including teh sexxors RP). So, like...your refusal to roleplay with 'owned slave' characters, while it may save you the mild annoyance of roleplaying with the so-called 'girlfriend slave' characters who ditch you soon as their 'IC mastah' logs in, it also sorta cuts you off from awesome players like me as well, so you might be missing out there. Or not. Who knows.

I gotta ask, though- how is "and hour or two of RP" wasted if the person playing the slave character has to post out of the scene at that point? Can't you pick the RP storyline up another time, like the next day or whenever the other person is free to jump in with you again? I can't say I see anything wrong with someone roleplaying with me for an hour or two, then having to jump out to meet up with their fave RP partner. If we had something interesting going, I'd hit 'em up for another scene sometime later on in the week when they were free next, and thank 'em for the hour or two of fun RP, myself. So I guess I don't get how/why you see that time as "wasted"...
"...to take truth for granted is not to know it. Truth not won is not possessed. We are not entitled to truths for which we have not fought." --- (Marauders of Gor, p.7)
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Qingwen
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Re: On slave role play...

Postby Qingwen » Mon Jan 25, 2016 11:13 pm

I've noticed slave players tend not to post a lot of dialogue - which is the easiest way to get someone to respond to your rp. Thoughts and descriptions are all well and good in the proper context, but why not just strike up a conversation, ask questions, or simply chat with other slave characters if the male characters are busy doing their bro bonding? The male characters (and some FW) seem to be the reverse, lots of dialogue with a dash of description thrown in.
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Sasi
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Re: On slave role play...

Postby Sasi » Mon Jan 25, 2016 11:56 pm

And do you avoid as well to RP with companioned FW, Tantrus?

Personally, I have often RPed with people playing a free that I should truly boring. I have no much fun getting involved in a little group of FW who are speaking of mundane stuff, about their family, how the city is nice, etc etc. It makes me yawn! And there are not only slaves who exit a RP because their owner logged on. FWs tend to do the same as well with their FC and it's very common to meet FCed character whose typist have a BF/GF relationship.
But I will not avoid FW because I have often met boring ones.

As for slaves emoting very long serves? Didn't see one these last 2 years, but I don't spend times in tavern and seldom ask a drink when playing with a slave :) But most of these slave players are taught this kind of RP in the lame Gorean schools which taught the way to play a perfect boring cookie cutter. Between them and the free characters who play the little tiny lovey dovey family story.... Sigh and bleeeh.....

And what Tamar said.

Qingwen: Slaves don't dialog often because they are not given matter to do this, since the free seldom talk to them in a RP group, since they must ask permission to speak, since it's rather hard to ask a question about a conversation occuring between free people, which is usually, none of the slave's business. Speaking with other slaves is possible, if of course, you stand or kneel close them.
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Re: On slave role play...

Postby Oor » Tue Jan 26, 2016 5:41 am

Tamar Luminos wrote:On the one hand, if some random guy character were to walk up to my slave character, snag her, shove her up against a wall for a quickie, then push a coin in her mouth and walk on- wow. That'd be one hell of a scene and I'd freakin' love it.


Did this on my mantoon some time ago. Walked into a city, city slave walks over all "can I serve you" - asked briefly if she was restricted - pushed her against the wall, raped her, zipped and went to head out.... MOUNTAINS OF SHIT FELL ON MY HEAD FROM FREE WOMEN BECAUSE OF THE TRAUMA I'D PUT THAT "POOR SLAVE GIRL" THROUGH.
I call my vagina "New Yorker cartoon" because it's dry and a handful of people have laughed at it.

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Saras
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Re: On slave role play...

Postby Saras » Tue Jan 26, 2016 8:49 am

Qingwen wrote:I've noticed slave players tend not to post a lot of dialogue - which is the easiest way to get someone to respond to your rp. Thoughts and descriptions are all well and good in the proper context, but why not just strike up a conversation, ask questions, or simply chat with other slave characters if the male characters are busy doing their bro bonding? The male characters (and some FW) seem to be the reverse, lots of dialogue with a dash of description thrown in.


I'm totally guilty of doing this and always trying to add more dialog to my posts. I think it's also a sign of some rpers who've been around during those massive serve posts. But also I've run into situations quite often that make me recoil from talking to much.

I recall one such scene where I was playing a slave and was rented from the slave house by a local warrior and taken to the baths. He wanted to be washed, which I was doing in my posts, but ALSO attempting to engage him in conversation. It was appropriate questions, and after only the second question I was told "shut up and just do what you're here to do". So i spent another hour (maybe more) doing literally nothing but action and description posts.

Often times slaves are seen and not heard. I get it. But how do you reconcile that with actually being an active participant in the scenes? Or should we just do away with the role entirely and use mesh dummies. Seems to me that quite a few see little difference.
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Re: On slave role play...

Postby Tantus » Tue Jan 26, 2016 11:45 am

Tamar Luminos wrote:I gotta ask, though- how is "and hour or two of RP" wasted if the person playing the slave character has to post out of the scene at that point? Can't you pick the RP storyline up another time, like the next day or whenever the other person is free to jump in with you again? I can't say I see anything wrong with someone roleplaying with me for an hour or two, then having to jump out to meet up with their fave RP partner. If we had something interesting going, I'd hit 'em up for another scene sometime later on in the week when they were free next, and thank 'em for the hour or two of fun RP, myself. So I guess I don't get how/why you see that time as "wasted"...


I totally get why discerning roleplayers want to avoid sexual exploitation. I wouldn't do it, and wouldn't expect others to bounce between strangers all night long,

What you're hitting on is you want your roleplay with some depth and meaning to it. And I get that too, but to really build a scene and surround those characters in suspense... it takes time and needs to flow without interruption.

In general, the superficial emotes you throw down are an introduction, there's little thought or meaning to it, you just post through an IC situation and continue on. Sometimes people reply in a way that your character picks up on, and they can be simple emotes but you begin to communicate on two channels. The conversation and the emoting. When you reach that point of understanding each other's humour, then you can go deeper. Superficial roleplaying works just like familiarising yourself with people in RL, knowing who you will and won't get along with.

I'm not talking about soulmating and falling in instant love here, but amongst all those gossiping FW and slaves who act like pets/children, you meet a character who seems like a 'normal' person behind the keyboard (An NBK?). Now you're beyond the introductory-roleplay stage and begin setting up towards a scene. When this person IMs with "OOC owner logged in, got to run ty".

I don't have an issue if someone walks up IC, roleplays, and takes his slave off. It's all legitimate then and adds onto the scene. But if it's done OOC'ly, then why would you revive roleplay with someone who can TP out at any random moment.

I haven't really been in the situation but if I was involved in a scene, then a regular RP partner logged in. It isn't possible that I'd IM the present roleplay and tell her I need to leave and RP with someone else. It's wrong on so many levels, I'd feel like a dick for doing it.
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Re: On slave role play...

Postby Tantus » Tue Jan 26, 2016 11:45 am

Sasi wrote:And do you avoid as well to RP with companioned FW, Tantrus?

Personally, I have often RPed with people playing a free that I should truly boring. I have no much fun getting involved in a little group of FW who are speaking of mundane stuff, about their family, how the city is nice, etc etc. It makes me yawn! And there are not only slaves who exit a RP because their owner logged on. FWs tend to do the same as well with their FC and it's very common to meet FCed character whose typist have a BF/GF relationship.
But I will not avoid FW because I have often met boring ones.

As for slaves emoting very long serves? Didn't see one these last 2 years, but I don't spend times in tavern and seldom ask a drink when playing with a slave :) But most of these slave players are taught this kind of RP in the lame Gorean schools which taught the way to play a perfect boring cookie cutter. Between them and the free characters who play the little tiny lovey dovey family story.... Sigh and bleeeh.....


I wouldn't avoid anyone who seems interested in roleplaying and is of interesting character. Obviously people in SL Gor look for different things, what's hot to me is a slave who's also a woman. It fits in more with the Gorean theme when a slave is challenging, seductive and preying upon free men. At this stage, men will fall to her, or throw the girl on her back and discipline her. It's all part of the game that men and slaves play.

In SL Gor, many slaves have had the sexuality taken out of them. I won't accuse those women playing slaves, it's more the environment they've entered into, which expects them to be docile, demure characters who float around, kneeling everywhere, trying to serve free food to every free person in sight.

It continues after all these years because people entering BTB , think that's what being a slave is all about. John Norman's idea of a Gorean slave, is a sensual woman. SL Gor tends towards immaturity and innocence.

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